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Season 2 irina and elsa

Discussion in 'Alias' started by crazy spinster, Mar 31, 2003.

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  1. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    who else loved the cool little parallel between irina & jack and elsa & neil?

    so do you think elsa really is "different" from irina? as in, do you think elsa and irina are really similar or different because of their love for their children. do you think elsa loves her son more than irina loves sydney?

    i kind of do. maybe it's just because irina's so good at guarding her emotions, we just don't SEE very much of her love for sydney. the biggest expression of emotion i can remember coming from irina was when she hugged sydney. but even then, it just felt like elsa's emotional reaction when jack was interrogating her was even stronger.

    also, this is sort of random, but if elsa was an russian agent like irina, how come she couldn't fight off her kidnappers? i mean, yeah, she was with her son, but you'd think she'd at least give some sort of try wouldn't you?
     
  2. The Kate Vartan

    The Kate Vartan Rocket Ranger

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    i do think that elsa and irina are different because caplan said that he knew the day he met her that she was a spy, so there is one difference. plus, no one can be compared to irina. she is in a category all of her own. but i did like that parallel.

    :innnocent: Kate
     
  3. lenkid

    lenkid Rocket Ranger

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    Maybe because if she fought back, she'd blow her cover, right?

    And I totally think she is different from Irina, because she hasn't bailed on the relationship yet, and it doesn't look like she had any intention of doing so, especially since she let Caplan know that she was SVR.
     
  4. Manu

    Manu Rocket Ranger

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    Elsa and Irina ARE different people but I do believe the same thing happened with both of them. They just have different motivations. I thought the whole Caplans story was totally foreshadowing to the Bristows. That and Irina using the word "sacrifice" in the same episode made it obvious to me.
     
  5. nancee

    nancee Rocket Ranger

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    o0o0o i klnow that was like so kool..irina and elsa did come frim the same place so its the same...but the part hat is diff is that neil knew adn jkack was stupid...what is the nsa anyways?
     
  6. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    yeah, elsa and irina are different, no doubt about it - elsa seems a bit less experienced than irina and yes, there was the fact that neil knew who she was the entire time. [side note: hmm...that must have been a really interesting relationship.]

    but i'm speaking more in terms of their love for their children. do you think elsa and irina love their children the same amount or do you think elsa loves her son more than irina loves sydney?
     
  7. lenkid

    lenkid Rocket Ranger

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    I'd have to say that Elsa seems to love her son more than Irina loves Sydney, because Irina has her obsession of Rambaldi that is her purpose in life, whereas Elsa doesn't have that. But then again, Irina has saved Sydney's life on numerous occasions, but we don't know if that was done for some other reason.
     
  8. Manu

    Manu Rocket Ranger

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    You just can't compare parents love for their children. It's like saying Caplan is a better parent than Jack and loves his son more than Jack loves Sydney. Irina loves Sydney. Period.
     
  9. nancee

    nancee Rocket Ranger

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    0o0o0 i think elsa loves her son more too!
     
  10. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    yes, irina is definitely an enigma so there's no real easy answer to that question. elsa seems a bit simpler (character-wise, that is). she seems to love her family and that's that. although, duh, she's only a guest character, so obviously she wouldn't seem as complex as irina, but still. :)
     
  11. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    manu - well, that's true, you can't really compare parents' love for their children. i didn't mean for it to come out sounding so callous.

    but i think the difference lies in elsa and irina's motivations. i think elsa's love for her son is more "pure" than irina's love for sydney. i'm in the "irina is evil" camp, so i tend to doubt irina's love for sydney. i think there's some ulterior motive there.
     
  12. Manu

    Manu Rocket Ranger

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    Heh... so that's it. Why anyone would question Irina's love for Sydney is beyond me.
     
  13. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    i don't know. irina's just so mysterious that i can't really take anything she says or does at face value. therefore, i just don't really trust that she truly loves sydney (at least the same way jack does. i know i know, there i go again comparing, but i can't help it. sorry!).
     
  14. Manu

    Manu Rocket Ranger

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    JJ wouldn't have used those parallels if they didn't mean anything. Elsa turned out to be SVR and Caplan NSA? And he knew about her? Just like that? It's all a set up to the Bristow storyline. Of course that's not gonna happen this season but that was still interesting. JJ is the foreshadowing king. And even though I thought this was the worst episode since Phase One, I have to give him props for the nice parallel.
     
  15. lenkid

    lenkid Rocket Ranger

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    Ok, I must have totally missed that. What exactly is he forshadowing for the Bristow storyline?
     
  16. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    manu - you thought this was the worst episode since phase one?! :o i thought this was the BEST post-phase one ep!! the elsa/irina parallel was just the icing on the cake. well, at least we can agree about that! :D

    and yes, jj is a foreshadowing/parallel GOD.
     
  17. Manu

    Manu Rocket Ranger

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    And I thought Phase One was the worst episode ever (after Masquerade) but that doesn't matter. :P

    But the parallel was AWESOME. Someone give VG and Emmy. No, really :blink: The actress that played Elsa is really good too. That scene was so emotional. (I'm no expert but I thought her Russian was perfect. )
     
  18. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    yes, the actress playing elsa was great. i see her EVERYWHERE. and she's a great guest on every show i've seen her on. which goes to show how talented an actress she is - that she can take on so many different characters and make them believable.

    but i still don't know what her name is. :confused:
     
  19. Manu

    Manu Rocket Ranger

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    It's Tracy.. something. :LOL:
     
  20. crazy spinster

    crazy spinster Rocket Ranger

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    middendorf! tracy middendorf! what an unusual last name... but yay, at least we know her name now. :)
     

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