Does Jack trust Irina?

[NumberSix]

True, but there is also the concept of 'need to know'. For this plan to work right, either Syd needs to know, or Jack needs to get her off the search team, by hook or by crook. Does anybody really believe that Jack couldn't get Sydney pulled from the Irina-hunt if he tried?

Having a Sydney who's feeling doubly betrayed and is, to put it mildly, mad as hell, hunting her mother is begging for disaster, as Vaughn and Dixon both recognize early in the episode. They're worried about Sydney, afraid she'll hesitate at some critical moment and die at Irina's hands, or end up killing her and have to live with that. But if Jack is really working with Irina, he has to worry that Sydney won't hesitate, that her anger might get the better of her and she'll really commit matricide.

She could do it. Irina is better than Sydney at this game, but not that much better. It's perfectly possible that a hostile encounter between mother and daughter could end with the daughter 'winning'. Then Jack has to deal with the double disaster (if they're really reconciled) of his wife's death and his daughter's guilt over killing her mother, redoubled if she ever finds out her mother wasn't really the enemy after all.

If Jack and Irina are working together at this point, Jack's overall game plan is very peculiar, to put it mildly.

 

[mexico city]

verdantheart, bravo to you and to Ophelia. 

Although I would consider myself a J/I RELATIONshipper, I do not WHORship Irina, especially at Jack's expense. 

I agree that she has not done anything to earn Jack's trust.  However, that does not stop him from trusting her.

He trusted her enough to get her permission to use the CIA's computer.  How did she replay that?  She used the computer to communicate with Sloane or Sark, can't remember which one.

Then in Panama, who knows what really happened?  Considering the actress chose only to fulfill her contact and nothing more, we don't know where that story would have gone, however, Jack did tell Syd that her mother betrayed them again.

However, even that didn't stop him from trusting her.  After Syd's death, he turned to the only person he could trust, Irina.

That of course landed him back in jail. 

How about the question on whether or not Irina was in contact with Syd?  Remember the key she gave Sloane?  It was in a code that Irina developed.  That would imply that she was in contact with Syd.  Why didn't she tell that to Jack?

Finally, when he needed her, when he asked for her help finding info on the Passenger.  How does she show her trust for him?  She cuts off communication.

No, she has not done anything to earn Jack's trust, but his love for her keeps getting in way of his better judgement.

I am, BTW, a J/I shipper.  I just see Irina's flaws.

[post="1049657"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

I am watching the box sets now from the beginning.
I have not yet watched all episodes, though I have seen 70% of the first two seasons.
I am half way through season three.
If I had to wait the week between episodes and deal with ad breaks, I think I would have gone insane.
I am looking forward to Jan. 5
As to the Bristow-Derevko issue, we have only cryptic information about the depth and nature of their relationship while married.
Jack rightly feels used for what happened.
He was bested and had.
His level of trust for Irina is evolving.
Irina has helped and supported Sydney.
That reinforces positive feelings from Jack to Irina.
But he never fully relents from his suspicion, I daresay.

 

[verdantheart]

if Jack turned her loose and doesn't mind the needless 'collateral damage' she's causing, we have to question Jack's own agenda.

[post="1121616"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

Perhaps Jack doesn't see it as "needless." That is, perhaps he saw the damage she was causing in custody (to the CIA and more importantly, to Sydney) as more grave than what she would cause on the loose--and once more categorized as an enemy. Remember, only Jack (well, OK, Vaughn did, but he wasn't getting anywhere but in trouble) saw her as a wolf in the fold.

But he never fully relents from his suspicion, I daresay.

[post="1121634"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

I daresay. That wouldn't be any fun. ^_^

 

[acting_chica]

i always have believed that irina is good. well, as good as you can be on alias after killing - what is it? - 12 cia agents and all. i think her true aims and goals are helpful if not to the u.s., at least to sydney and/or jack.
i think jack loves irina with all he has. i also think he wishes with everything that he has that he could just get her out of his head. i don't think he trusts her, because she did betray him horribly, but i think he could. i think he would like to. i think he would die if he and she could just live a (quasi-)normal life.
just my opinion.
m-c

 

[NumberSix]

Perhaps Jack doesn't see it as "needless." That is, perhaps he saw the damage she was causing in custody (to the CIA and more importantly, to Sydney) as more grave than what she would cause on the loose--and once more categorized as an enemy. Remember, only Jack (well, OK, Vaughn did, but he wasn't getting anywhere but in trouble) saw her as a wolf in the fold. 

Yeah, but what I was referring to was the theory that Jack and Irina made an alliance in Panama, and that she didn't really betray him there. I think that theory is really, really hard to support, and if it's true, it means that Jack is essentially going along with Irina's (at best) reckless disregard for bystanders.

That doesn't seem like Jack, somehow. We've seen hm do ruthless things to protect Sydney, but even then, he seems to usually choose options that minimize harm to others as much as he can. For ex, the resuce op when Jack, Vaughn, Sloane, and the rest saved Sydney from the Dr. Mengele and Lindsey. Jack went to some extra trouble and considerable extra cost to make sure that the guards and other personnel weren't killed.

Jack can be ruthless, but he seems to ahve his limits, and he's not recklessly ruthless. Irina, on the other hand...

 

[NumberSix]

i always have believed that irina is good. well, as good as you can be on alias after killing - what is it? - 12 cia agents and all. i think her true aims and goals are helpful if not to the u.s., at least to sydney and/or jack.

Yeah, but there's a limit to how far those can be separated. Jack and Sydney have, for their own reasons, chosen to spend their time and skills protecting (as best they can discern them) the interests and safety of America. Past a certain point, you can't work against America and the JTF without also working against Jack and Sydney.

i think jack loves irina with all he has. i also think he wishes with everything that he has that he could just get her out of his head.

That, I agree with totally.