Light the fires & kick the tires

Eniko

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Nov 13, 2007
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Netherlands
To be fair with how long HJ has been under development Simu totally had that one coming. Especially after claiming they'd start updating the site more which lasted all of what, 3 weeks before resuming total radio silence?

Just can't get excited about it anymore.
 

HJ-Diviana

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Joined
Feb 27, 2006
Location
St. Charles, MO
Especially after claiming they'd start updating the site more which lasted all of what, 3 weeks before resuming total radio silence
I don't remember claiming the site would be updated frequently again (if anyone said it, it was probably me), just that it WAS updated more often for a while..

Do you have a link?
 

HJ-Diviana

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Feb 27, 2006
Location
St. Charles, MO
Well I did find http://www.play.net/hj/info/news/news.asp?id=118. Apparently I've misremembered slightly (I'm notorious for my bad memory) but still, there was a short burst of site activity from april-september and then it just stopped again which I find pretty disappointing.
And it said "over the next few months" out of which (5 months) there was some activity :P

I understand the frustration. It's hard on us watching you guys wish for it to be finished, but things are moving along.
 

Daax

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Joined
May 10, 2006
I seriously believe Simu is not only jerking us around, but also jerking their development staff around. They do have people working on the game, but they haven't told those people yet that they are never actually planning on releasing it.

While I do think it's great that the HeroEnginge is now the standard for MMOs, if you guys don't start advertising HJ(if you actually plan on releasing it, that it) then it's gonna flop within a year of it's release and end up being closed down, just like good MMO's such as TR.

But with that being said, I don't think the game is ever gonna be released. I just wish somebody would tell me so I can quit wasting my time.
 

Valendros

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Joined
Jul 27, 2006
I think Simu really believes it's going to release the game. I just think the management is so backwards there that they haven't figured out that with their current level of work it would take 20 years. I think they haven't realized that free work isn't going to get the game out. You need real employees.

You can say you're going to release a game until you're blue in the face, but that doesn't mean it's going to happen.

Quick and free hint. Take the number of people that Bioware is using to make their game, and add 25%. That's how many people you need on your payroll, in a building or two. The development, off-site gamemasters are EXTRA to that, not included in it.
 

HJ-Diviana

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Feb 27, 2006
Location
St. Charles, MO
There are good reasons for going quiet. There are good reasons the release dates were pushed back, and eventually removed. The game is being worked on, by people who ARE on-site.

All of you speculate. That's it. You're speculating, guessing about something you can't see and know nothing of. I will tell you now that at least half of the conversation in here has absolutely no bearing on what's really happening.

I'm sorry if I am coming across negatively, but that's all you guys are throwing out these days. If you're just going to be negative, what is the point of wasting everyone's time?

I still take the time to come here and read posts almost every day. Then I sit here for twenty minutes writing three paragraphs that I rephrase over and over as not to tell too much but still try to get a point across, but I guess I should just drop it and let it lie until HJ is ready to be more publicly active.
 

Valendros

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Joined
Jul 27, 2006
There are good reasons for going quiet. There are good reasons the release dates were pushed back, and eventually removed. The game is being worked on, by people who ARE on-site.

All of you speculate. That's it. You're speculating, guessing about something you can't see and know nothing of. I will tell you now that at least half of the conversation in here has absolutely no bearing on what's really happening.

I'm sorry if I am coming across negatively, but that's all you guys are throwing out these days. If you're just going to be negative, what is the point of wasting everyone's time?

I still take the time to come here and read posts almost every day. Then I sit here for twenty minutes writing three paragraphs that I rephrase over and over as not to tell too much but still try to get a point across, but I guess I should just drop it and let it lie until HJ is ready to be more publicly active.
The reason we're negative is two fold. A) We really wanted to play the game and B) We're not stupid.

Simu isn't moving into their larger office. We know that their old (and current) office are far too small to fit enough people to make a competitive MMO. We know that if Simu was serious about releasing the game, it would be at a point where they would want to start to advertising and drumming up a fanbase. And most importantly, we know that with the space restrictions there is virtually no way to work on multiple large projects at a time, one is going to take precedence and which one will it be? Hero Engine will take precedence every time.

I never said HJ wasn't being worked on by on-site people. I said HJ wasn't being worked on by ENOUGH on-site people to get a release date in this decade. And anything outside this decade it will be so out-dated it won't even matter.
 

HJ-Diviana

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Feb 27, 2006
Location
St. Charles, MO
Simu isn't moving into their larger office.
There is a completely valid reason, but since I do not believe it has been disclosed elsewhere, I will not go into it here.


We know that their old (and current) office are far too small to fit enough people to make a competitive MMO. We know that if Simu was serious about releasing the game, it would be at a point where they would want to start to advertising and drumming up a fanbase.
I'm not going to guess on what size office IS necessary, as I believe quality of work should always trump quantity. They could fill a huge office to the brim with mediocre workers, but I'd rather have a small office of people who do really amazing things.

At this point in time, they do not feel it is necessary or ready or whatever to start trying to get people excited. Things started going quiet when Melissa left Simu. A lot of things changed. HJ two years ago is NOT HJ today. There is still work to do, and with any millions of things that CAN go wrong and delay things for longer. Why would it be smart to repeat what happened previously with release dates and such? It just pulls more people in to hear "HJ is never coming out", or "HJ has been in development for ten years!!" but neither of those are true. HJ was a CONCEPT ten years ago, but it was nothing of a game.


And most importantly, we know that with the space restrictions there is virtually no way to work on multiple large projects at a time, one is going to take precedence and which one will it be? Hero Engine will take precedence every time.
This is pure speculation. You don't know the amount of people or space that it takes to make a game. You don't know how many people or how much space is on-site. Have you ever been to the office? Have you met the people who work there? Have you taken count of the programmers, game devs, or artists?

I mean lets throw out numbers. What is an acceptable amount of people to you to make a game? How much space should there be?


I never said HJ wasn't being worked on by on-site people. I said HJ wasn't being worked on by ENOUGH on-site people to get a release date in this decade. And anything outside this decade it will be so out-dated it won't even matter.
You'd be surprised at how well HJ has aged. You forget that Simu owns the engine. Besides, people still play WoW and we all have heard the complaints there. It's about the fun in the end.
 

Eniko

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Joined
Nov 13, 2007
Location
Netherlands
Well Diviana I guess there's nothing we can really do besides take your word for it. Can you at least imagine why some of us are getting pretty skeptical though?
 

Dyngo

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Joined
Mar 15, 2006
Location
Sweden
HJ was a CONCEPT ten years ago, but it was nothing of a game.
I would include the "concept"-period in the development time, at least I can't see why it should be excluded.

But since pretty much all our latest official updates is concept images and the game features list is pretty much from before Melissa left simu, most stuff tells me that HJ is still a "CONCEPT".

(And what Eniko said)
 

HJ-Diviana

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Joined
Feb 27, 2006
Location
St. Charles, MO
I would include the "concept"-period in the development time, at least I can't see why it should be excluded.

But since pretty much all our latest official updates is concept images and the game features list is pretty much from before Melissa left simu, most stuff tells me that HJ is still a "CONCEPT".

(And what Eniko said)
The HJ that was a concept was 100% scrapped because the engine they were using was not capable of doing the things they wanted to, so they decided to make their own. You can't just make a game engine overnight. Go look at the old video or screenshots from 1999.

Eniko, yes, I understand why you guys are skeptical. Nothing I can do about it really.

Valendros, that visit was over two years ago and those pictures aren't very accurate.

Anyway I've decided I am taking a break from HH for a while. I understand you're frustrated, but man it's hard being jumped on over everything I say, especially since I can only regurgitate the same old every time. The other GMs have already gone quiet, and now I guess it's my time to too.
 
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