Politics Thrown Out of Church for being a Democrat...

Jamison

Cadet
Ousted church members ponder next move
Kicked out for not voting for President Bush


WAYNESVILLE, North Carolina (AP) -- A pastor who led a charge to kick out nine church members who refused to support President Bush was the talk of the town Saturday in this mountain hamlet, with ousted congregants considering hiring a lawyer.

Pastor Chan Chandler greeted people at the door of tiny East Waynesville Baptist Church on Saturday evening as the church choir practiced and even welcomed them to attend services Sunday morning -- if there's room inside. But he was not prepared to talk about his mixing of religion and politics.

"On the advice of counsel, I've been advised not to have any comment at this time," Chandler told The Associated Press. "We will have a statement later."

Members of the congregation said Chandler told them during last year's presidential campaign that anyone who planned to vote for Democratic nominee John Kerry needed to leave the church.

Longtime member Selma Morris, who was treasurer at the church, said Chandler's sermons remained political after Bush won re-election. This past week, his comments turned to politics again at a church gathering that ended with nine members voted out.

Morris said Saturday that some of the ousted members planned to meet with an attorney on Monday to discuss their options. "We're hoping he (the attorney) will make him leave so that the church members can come back," she said.

"This is very disturbing," said Pastor Robert Prince III, who leads the congregation at the nearby First Baptist Church. "I've been a pastor for more than 25 years, and I have never seen church members voted out for something like this."

Those who are still members did not know if the church would be open for services Sunday, or if Chandler would be in the pulpit to preach.

The 100-member East Waynesville Baptist Church sits on a bluff a short distance from downtown Waynesville, a mountain town about 125 miles northwest of Charlotte. A white steeple and stain glass windows adorn the simple brick structure, built in 1965, with a view of the mountains from the front steps.

Across the street sits the church's parsonage, a small brick ranch home with children's toys scattered in the front lawn. A small wooden sign out front reads simply "The Chandlers." No one answered the phone there on Saturday.

In the days since the nine members were ousted, many more members have reportedly left the church in protest.

"He went on and on about how he's going to bring politics up, and if we didn't agree with him, we should leave," Isaac Sutton told The News and Observer of Raleigh. "I think I deserve the right to vote for who I want to."

Sutton, a deacon who worshipped at East Waynesville Baptist Church for the past 12 years, said he and his wife were among the nine voted out.

"I've been going to this church for 25 years and I've never had a problem," Sutton's wife, Lorene, told The Associated Press on Friday. "He's young and he thinks he knows everything."

Other former members of the church declined to speak with a reporter Saturday, citing the advice of their attorney. But the furor over politics at the church was the talk of Waynesville, a community of about 9,200 residents.

"It's just an outrage for something like this to happen in America," said Heidi Jenkins, 52, as she held a garage sale at her home down the street from the church.

Prince said he noticed during the presidential campaign that more pastors made endorsements -- although not from the pulpit -- than in past years.

"It used to be that pastors would speak about the issues and not specific candidates," he said. "I think that line is being crossed."

Though not religious, I've kind of taken an interest in this topic because it's not all that far from where I live.

I understand that a church technically doesn't have to serve everyone, but it seems ridiculous to kick members out because of their political party.

Your thoughts?
 
This makes me sick. :angry:

America seems to think they own Christianity, and are turning into an exclusive club - a far cry from the welcoming organisation it is in other parts of the world.
 
littlebirdy said:
This makes me sick. :angry:

America seems to think they own Christianity, and are turning into an exclusive club - a far cry from the welcoming organisation it is in other parts of the world.
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Exactly. Apparently this Pastor doesn't believe you can be Christian and Democratic...which is awful.
 
Here's another article about it...

N.C. Church Kicks Out Members Who Do Not Support Bush

Associated Press
Sunday, May 8, 2005; A12



WAYNESVILLE, N.C., May 7 -- Some in Pastor Chan Chandler's flock wish he had a little less zeal for the GOP.

Members of the small East Waynesville Baptist Church say Chandler led an effort to kick out congregants who did not support President Bush. Nine members were voted out at a Monday church meeting in this mountain town about 120 miles west of Charlotte. Forty others in the 400-member congregation resigned in protest.

"He's the kind of pastor who says 'Do it my way or get out,' " said Selma Morris, the former church treasurer. "He's real negative all the time."

Chandler told WLOS-TV in Asheville on Friday that the actions were not politically motivated, but on Saturday he refused to comment, citing the advice of his attorney.

During the presidential election last year, Chandler told the congregation that anyone who planned to vote for the Democratic nominee, Sen. John F. Kerry (Mass.), should either leave the church or repent, former member Lorene Sutton said.

Some church members left after Chandler made his ultimatum in October, Morris said.

George Bullard, associate executive director-treasurer for Baptist State Convention of North Carolina, told the Asheville Citizen-Times that a pastor may disallow memberships if a church's bylaws allow the pastor to establish criteria for membership.

"Membership is a local church issue," he said. "It is not something the state convention would enter into."

He added that the nine members were not legally terminated, because Monday's meeting was supposed to be a deacons meeting, not a business meeting. They have a lawyer looking into the situation, he said.

The head of the North Carolina Democratic Party sharply criticized the pastor Friday, saying Chandler jeopardized his church's tax-free status by openly supporting a candidate for president.

"If these reports are true, this minister is not only acting extremely inappropriately by injecting partisan politics into a house of worship, but he is also potentially breaking the law," Chairman Jerry Meek said.

I understand that it is a private organization and they can allow (or not allow) whoever they want into the church. But this seems highly inappropriate. One of the members that was ousted had been a member for 25 years, and now just because he didn't support Bush, he's been kicked out.

And as the article states, by doing this he is only hurting the church. The issue of churchs backing one political candidate came under fire during the election, and the IRS said that a preference for or against a certain candidate or party becomes prohibited and by doing this a church could lose their tax-free status.
 
Okay. I'm a strong Christian and a strong Republican. I believe that most of the people in my church are Republicans, but I know for a fact that one couple are Democrats and they serve very important roles in the church. I don't agree with their political views, but they are Godly people and I respect (and like) them very much. The Bible does not say that you have to be a Republican in order to go to church. It doesn't say that you have to be a Bush-supporter. The Bible does call for Christians to pray for those in leadership however, so regardless of who's in office, my church tries to pray for the President as he makes various decisions (whether he's a Republican or a Democrat). God loves everyone, regardless of their political views, and He wants all to come to a saving knowledge of Him. It's stuff like this that really bothers me because it gives Christians a bad name. We're not all like this.
 
OMG! Who does that? It's their choice! Church is so stupid these days. All we talk about is if you don't do it my way, get out. I'n really getting quite sick of it. This is really stupid!
 
the_alliance said:
the churches should kick out all Americans, cuz Democrats and Republicans are both evil in their own ways.

but then again, the churches should welcome ALL Americans cuz Jesus hung out with the worst of the worst and Americans are just that.
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I'm not going to say that America and its citizens doesn't have its faults but what you said is really offensive. Every country and politics as whole has its flaws so it is really unfair to call Americans "worst of the worst" just because you do not like our President and his politics. I don't like Tony Blair but I would never call those who live in the Britain evil. Also, there is no such thing as a perfect or pure political party.
 
'Great Misunderstand' or Kicked Out of Church Over Political Beliefs?
Associated Press
Monday, May 9, 2005


The pastor calls it a "great "misunderstanding." But church members who say they were kicked out because of their political beliefs want him to go.

One member of the small Baptist church in western North Carolina says "things will never be the same here until he leaves." Thelma Lowe and her husband were among nine people voted out.

The ousted members say Reverend Chan Chandler told them during last year's presidential campaign that anyone who planned to vote for John Kerry needed to leave the church.

But some back the pastor. Pam Serafin says, "There are always two sides to every story."

Chandler didn't directly address the controversy during Sunday's service. But he issued a statement afterward through his attorney saying the church does not care about its members' political affiliations.


What do you wanna bet that he's now calling it a 'great misunderstanding' because, after hiring a lawyer, he's discovered that what he was doing is illegal?

Utterly ridiculous. If I were a member that got thrown out, I would still pursue legal action, and would certainly not set foot in that church again.


the_alliance Posted Yesterday, 09:55 PM
  the churches should kick out all Americans, cuz Democrats and Republicans are both evil in their own ways.

but then again, the churches should welcome ALL Americans cuz Jesus hung out with the worst of the worst and Americans are just that.

There are many things wrong with that statement. While Democrats, Republicans, and Americans for that matter have their flaws I would never group the vast majority of them under a category of 'evil'.

And I wouldn't call Americans 'the worst of the worst'. Have you been to Sudan or see the human rights violations in Saudi Arabia? I think it's awful to call members of your country 'the worst of the worst'...you don't know everyone here, and maybe you forget that thanks to our media we usually here about the deviant ones. Not the ones who are donating money to charity or travelling overseas to help people.

Churches should be open to EVERYONE in the entire world...regardless of political party, sex, race, or native land.
 
you are right. i was just in a very bad mood when i posted that, so i retract what i said.

but just in my defense, i am an American too so technically, i can say that if i want to. and as for the democrat and republican thing, i think that fair-opportunity bashing was only "fair".
 
the_alliance said:
you are right. i was just in a very bad mood when i posted that, so i retract what i said.

but just in my defense, i am an American too so technically, i can say that if i want to. and as for the democrat and republican thing, i think that fair-opportunity bashing was only "fair".
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Of course you can say what you want to. BUT not in a forum like this where there are rules and regulations as to what you can say. If you don't like it and wish to bash Americans, that can be done on numerous forums elsewhere.


But getting back to the topic at hand...here's an update.


Pastor Resigns After Bush Battle
WAYNESVILLE, N.C., May 11, 2005


A Baptist preacher accused of running off nine congregants who refused to support President Bush resigned Tuesday.

"I am resigning with gratitude in my heart for all of you, particularly those of you who love me and my family," the Rev. Chan Chandler said during a meeting at East Waynesville Baptist Church.

Congregants of the 100-member church in western North Carolina have said Chandler endorsed President Bush from the pulpit during last year's presidential campaign and said that anyone who planned to vote for Democratic nominee Sen. John Kerry needed to "repent or resign."

The church members said he continued to preach about politics after President Bush won re-election, culminating with a church gathering last week in which the nine members said they were ousted.

Chandler's resignation came a day after a national group that lobbies for church-state separation urged the Internal Revenue Service to investigate the tax-exempt status of the East Waynesville Baptist Church.

IRS rules bar clear-cut politicking by tax-exempt groups. Last October, days before President Bush won a second term, the IRS said it was investigating about 60 charities and other tax-exempt groups - about a third of them churches - for potentially breaking rules that bar them from participating in political activity.

The outcome of those investigations is not known. The IRS is barred from naming the organizations it probes or announcing case results.

At Sunday's service, the 33-year-old Chandler said the flap over the church members' dismissal was "a great misunderstanding" and he tried to welcome them back.

"No one has ever been voted from the membership of this church due to an individual's support or lack of support for a political party or candidate," he said in a statement.

But the dismissed members, who attended the service with their lawyer and other supporters, said there was no misunderstanding and the only way to heal the rift is for Chandler to leave.
 
In the future, please contact a mod if you have a problem with a post - it's our job to enforce rules and regs. (And for the record, though I may not agree with her statement, she was expressing her opinion just like the rest of y'all, which is completely fine).
 
Jinnie said:
In the future, please contact a mod if you have a problem with a post - it's our job to enforce rules and regs. (And for the record, though I may not agree with her statement, she was expressing her opinion just like the rest of y'all, which is completely fine).
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Sorry, I was just trying to put an end to that and get us back on topic.

And someone did contact a mod and had it taken care of. A mod was contacted and it was taken care of...and the_alliance made this very well known.
 
Then I hardly see the need for another lecture. :smiley: The best way to coax a thread back on topic is to sharply go back to it and not linger. (And I'd hope that any consequences to another member, if any result, would be kept confidential).

Anyway.

I consider myself more independent than anything, but this story appalled me. The pastor may have felt like he was taking a stand, but he's contributing to making Christianity a joke. I hope he's proud.
 
Jinnie said:
Then I hardly see the need for another lecture. :smiley: The best way to coax a thread back on topic is to sharply go back to it and not linger. (And I'd hope that any consequences to another member, if any result, would be kept confidential).

Anyway.

I consider myself more independent than anything, but this story appalled me. The pastor may have felt like he was taking a stand, but he's contributing to making Christianity a joke. I hope he's proud.
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The only reason I brought them up, was because in another post in this forum, the_alliance made a point of telling everyone that he was suspended for what he said over here, that was the only way I knew (since I was not the one who contacted the mods). So I felt that for that reason it was common knowledge.



Anyways, this story has been interesting to watch, since my hometown isn't all that far away from Waynesville. There have been people outraged that these 9 members were kicked out, but sadly many more people outraged at the fact that he ended up resigning. I guess they just don't understand how wrong and very illegal it was for him to do what he was doing.
 
I just think that it's completely wrong for this church to turn democrats away. First it perpetuates the image that Christians are extremists and that God only favors those in the red states. People can be against Bush and still be for God!
 
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