What really would happen if aliens came to this planet

Tom

An Old Friend
Joined
Dec 6, 2004
Location
Gulf Coast
You can see a universe
I can see a universe
Um, Sorry... We are both in THE Universe. One of mankind's biggest delusions is that we are somehow outside the Universe looking in. Everything everyone can know, dream or fantasize is IN THE UNIVERSE. Yes, That means The Universe thinks, dreams and knows. At our level of consciousness we are unable to fathom the Universe's level of awareness but perhaps that is not so for aliens species that have developed for a million or 100 million years. Its a tough concept to grasp and most people can't even go there but with some discipline we can touch the edge.

universe that is all creativity and art
Creativity is something different than art. Creativity is all around us. From atoms to galactic super-clusters. Art is a concept that is rooted in our perceptions and associations. Art is a learned appreciation. If we put the whole concept of art to the entire spectrum of life as we know it. Art is not a common thing. You can teach a chimp to paint a picture. You can teach it to look at the picture and enjoy it. What chimp, in the wild paints pictures, makes music that is repeatable, sculptures their parents likeness out of river mud? That is just a chimp, What about the other billion or so life forms that are on our planet? What kind of pencil sketches make worms take notice? Do the trees get excited over the sunset colors? Which termite mound is a sculpture of their God? Do birds sing for the same reason as humans create music? My point is that just because we perceive art in nature doesn't mean it was intended as art.
The Universe may not appreciate creativity and art.
In the essence of we being part of the Universe it does, because we do. I should have wrote 'Aliens may not appreciate creativity and art'. Creativity is such a common thing in the Universe an alien mindset may not even acknowledge its existence. If it does, It might not place as much value on it as we do. It's possible aliens may not be able to perceive beauty. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, Aliens may not have a need for eyes as we understand them. Perhaps they appreciate patterns or as a beauty to behold, the absence of patterns.
according to law
Funny thing about law, Its not a law unless it is agreed upon by all concerning parties. A natural law is one that supposedly cannot be broken in all the Universe so if it is breakable it is not a law. I give you Black Holes. If known natural laws can be broken within a Black Hole then the known natural laws are not really laws but suppositions. We are like infants compared to the age of the Universe and possible alien intelligences. Place 2 million of our years against hundreds of millions or even billions of years and you realize that what we think we know is far, far less that what we don't know. To assume that humans have it all figured out is our own delusion.
difficulty accepting
We all have difficulty accepting. We have programmed our thinking with bounding boxes. To think outside the common delusions is considered insanity. At our level of development perhaps it is insanity. It's a hard discipline to even attempt to fathom reality.
Science sees patterns
Science sees patterns but only in a conservative way. Chaos itself can be a pattern depending on the scope of the comparison. Point geometric is one example I like that shows chaos in a pattern. You take a point (A true point) and radiate lines out from it on all sides perpendicular from the point. We see a star. We see only a finite number of trajectories possible but we can split each arc in half and add another trajectory based on that. Not only around the circumference but around the entire sphere. Given enough distance, every arc is divisible no matter how close they are at the point. Now, This will blow your mind, add a true point directly beside the first and do the same thing. Then fill all the space in the known universe with points with the same radial lines. This already exists. If this was beheld/observed it might look like chaos, it would be chaos but it is also a predictable pattern. To give you some insight on this concept imagine a single atom. The space within every atom is sparse compared to a true point. The components of atoms are made up of structures such as neutrinos, quarks, muons and the like. Within the scope of each of those components lies even more true points. Even the elusive boson is composed of true points. And that is still only a scientific observation made by a species less than 2 million years in the making.
The first law of thermodynamics, states that the energy of a closed system must remain constant—it can neither increase nor decrease without interference from outside. The universe itself is a closed system, so the total amount of energy in existence has always been the same. The forms that energy takes, however, are constantly changing.
Everything in nature everywhere is comprised of energy. It is the ... GOD ...of the natural world. It takes many forms but it persists and has been around for MORE than 14 Billion years. It has never dissipated or grown. My feeble mind quantifies energy on the same level as the radius of a true point.
Not to be confused with the quantum concept of Zero Point Energy. The quantum world comprises the uncertainty of nature. Quantum dynamics opens paths of dialog that I am currently unwilling to discuss due to the limitations of this topic's parameters. Not to dismiss an alien's possible understanding of quantum science but because it requires more in-depth discussion than would be appropriate for this topic.
Vacuum Energy is also a very interesting topic in itself. It basically destroys the first law of thermodynamics. Stating that energy is constantly being created and destroyed in the Universe.
The reason I expound on the things I do in this topic is that we need to realize that an alien culture that is even slightly more advanced than us might already know our fundamental laws of nature are flawed. Sorta like the silly belief that the speed of light is a barrier. We already know of particles that can exceed that limitation, Neutrinos from an exploding supernova as one example. We know because we have observed them.
Imagine the dismay of our best scientists when an alien reveals proof of anything that goes beyond their concepts of the natural laws. It's not just the random Joe that aliens will affect. It will be humanity as a whole.
 
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AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
Um, Sorry... We are both in THE Universe. One of mankind's biggest delusions is that we are somehow outside the Universe looking in. Everything everyone can know, dream or fantasize is IN THE UNIVERSE. Yes, That means The Universe thinks, dreams and knows. At our level of consciousness we are unable to fathom the Universe's level of awareness but perhaps that is not so for aliens species that have developed for a million or 100 million years. Its a tough concept to grasp and most people can't even go there but with some discipline we can touch the edge.
OK, for the sake of argument let us go outside the edge {out of the box so to speak}; Agreed that everything may be considered as part of the universe - But that does not prove an outside edge exists - How do you know or how can you prove there is anything outside of the universe? It is conceivable that what we perceive and define as the universe is all there is. No need to step outside as there is nothing outside and since nothing can not exist
there is nothing else. We need go no further {except for purposes of expanded and different points of observation} because we are part of all that is. Can we observe it all? Can we adequately define it? Probably not as we and the universe appear to be dynamic and ever changing. But we can get a better handle on it and increase the observational limits. Ultimately a sci-fi dreamer such as yours truly says we can control it - literally rule it.
This remains to be seen.

PS: Your other comments are interesting observations and some I agree with - Others that I think might be debatable or worth comment I'll get back to later.
 

Tom

An Old Friend
Joined
Dec 6, 2004
Location
Gulf Coast
I completely understand what you are saying and as philosophy goes it is wonderful to speculate. You however do not understand the one fundamental thing that few others understand. By imagining yourself outside the Universe you make it that much bigger. I will try to keep it short and simple.
1. We are all made up of elements that are in the Universe - Thus we are part of the Universe, not the entire Universe but part of it all the same.
2. When a distant star supernovas, even if we don't see it the supernova happened in the Universe. Every particle of carbon, wisp of gas and area of void is also part of the Universe.
3. Being inside the Universe, Every thought, dream, idea, language, work of art and feeling is part of the Universe. Everything that can be understood or imagined is in fact the Universe doing so.
It's a difficult concept to wrap your head around and humanity is bred to think otherwise. It still doesn't change the facts. Being within the Universe makes us the Universe. When we try to imagine ourselves outside the Universe the imagination that creates the reference is also inside the Universe. Thus the Universe expands By its imagination. The Universe is everything we are and more. Physical and meta-physical, spiritual and scientific. It all sources from within its boundaries. If any one boundary is pushed, its the Universe that pushes and any new ground that is had, whether it be solid or imagined, is engulfed by the Universe.
Many people think the Universe is only the 3d solid reality stuff like stars and planets but everything within its existence is within it. Including all those things that can't be quantified.

Here is something that I like to ponder, Its a What If?

What if humans are the only life form that thinks of itself as outside the Universe?
What if all other life, known & unknown, automatically knows what we dismiss?
What if an alien, a worm or a tree knows all the secrets of the Universe that we can't/won't see?
What if the unknown can be revealed by just removing the delusions we teach ourselves?

Granted it would be difficult, if not impossible, for some of us. Humanity breeds delusions into itself every generation. However, if you think about albinos and how that condition can manifest itself over generations and how many albinos are on this planet you can realize that clarity can also be manifest over generations.

Once the delusions start to fall, clarity begins to take shape. Since the delusions are a taught trait, reinforced by generations, that trait can be overcome.

This is but the tip of the iceberg of things that humanity is deluded about. Some alien culture that may visit us may not be deluded at all. Their ways and reasons may be so clear that we will not be able to cope because it breaks the delusions that we hold dear. Delusions we don't even know we have.

If someone strips a delusion from you it is scary to experience. A violation of your comfort zone. You respond to it as a threat, getting mad, sad or uneasy. Once the delusion is revealed and you understand that you were deluded you can exist in that clarity and you wonder how you deluded yourself in the first place.

The delusions that we experience are not all bad when considering humanity. Society, laws and commerce are all built on delusions that benefit our species. Rights give us balance and integrity. Ownership drives understanding and fuels expansion. Love & Hate dictate our path in sociability. Sociability creates unification. And So On...
The delusions make us who we are and what we will become. ON THIS PLANET.

Aliens may have different delusions or none at all.
 

Tom

An Old Friend
Joined
Dec 6, 2004
Location
Gulf Coast
It is conceivable that what we perceive and define as the universe is all there is.
I once wrote a question to The School of Champions asking where the edge of the Universe is at. I included a question based on the observational theory that the Universe is expanding so Where is it expanding from? Where is the center?
They referred me to a long list of theoretical scientists and I actually contacted one of them by email.
The reply was simple:
"There is no edge, Refer to quantum physics. The center is everywhere, Refer to vacuum energy."
I tried to continue the discussion but never got another reply. So I researched what I was referred to and found out those simple answers he gave me were indeed true, Theoretically.

Now even though some scientists are world-renowned they are still only humans. Still stuck on this same planet as you and I. Still restricted by some delusions that are unbreakable at our present evolutionary point. In the past scientific facts are proven wrong by new scientific facts. To consider that we can know everything about anything is a delusion. We don't even understand ourselves and we have plenty of samples and many years of observation, not to mention an inside view.

If this discussion were slanted to explore the realm of science fiction I could understand the wish to explore such a point of view. But...This topic is intended to be a realistic exploration of the impact of an actual alien visit and how people would react in real life at such a revelation. My diversions are intended to open paths of thinking that justify some reactions of some people that are more reality inclined. The population masses would not be able to handle such an event but some individuals may embrace it. Some individuals may handle the extreme thinking that would result. I believe people that are science fiction oriented will have a better chance at remaining sane while hard core scientifically minded individuals will crack due to the destruction of their hard set laws and rationality. People of religious persuasion will become angry and want war or collapse into their own hell. There won't be many that will even try to understand the unknown. The Scifi mind will be open to possibilities that others can't or won't even consider. On top of all that...Everyone might be completely wrong and the reality may be something else entirely.
 

AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
Mostly agree with what you have just said in your last two posts.

As far as the reaction of humans to aliens I believe one of those think tanks already did a report and I believe there is book on the subject {can't think of the name off hand}. The report was negative saying there would be problems. Among 'conspiracy buffs' this is one of the reasons they believe the government{s} are covering-up what they already know - Aliens are real and they have already made contact. I say MAYBE?
 

AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
Don't believe aliens have already come to this planet? Want to see a close to proof that they have? Want to hear from reputable scientists telling you about technology some of which has come from documented UFO crashes documented by reputable persons from the military - Then try this documentary video - Will be of special interest to you with a scientific mind who want to see into the future.

UFOs ABOVE TOP SECRET - HD & UPDATED – Secrecy, Tesla, Energy, Antigravity & Interstellar Travel


"The Future is Now...."
 

Tom

An Old Friend
Joined
Dec 6, 2004
Location
Gulf Coast
Aliens are real and they have already made contact. I say MAYBE?
Since probability is rooted in Chaos and possibility is rooted in imagination I agree that anything is possible. Its even possible that aliens changed the human genome 2 million years ago to create sentience in us on purpose. I even think its probable that aliens contact us regularly with transmission methods that we can not yet fathom. It's probable that aliens do exist both more and less advanced than we are.

Want to see a close to proof that they have?
In today's world no video, audio or photo can ever be 'trusted' to be proof of anything. I personally am not interested in watching videos, especially videos that are slanted to an agenda to show proof. Just recently there was a big scandal about how the documentary syndicates were using statements from scientists to show proof while the scientists themselves admitted that their statements were taken out of context and were used as answers to questions the documentary team never asked them. Back when I 'was' watching the so called science & history channels I still had issue with the way they edited the documentaries. Even the animal nature shows were unbelievable for the statements that they made.

UFO Secrecy: First we must agree that UFO does not mean alien. UFO is Unidentified Flying Object. As for secrecy, it is likely that there are instances when something is seen in the sky and being unknown it is kept secret. Just because they are not sure what to call it. It could be ball lightning or a slow meteorite that doesn't burn up during atmospheric descent. Speculation runs rampant when something is unidentified but the key point that seems to be overlooked is that is Unidentified.

Free Energy: Free energy is already abundant. Free energy is not the monetary value of the energy. It is energy that needs no work to utilize. Your body uses free energy constantly. There is this big ball of fire in the sky that gives it to us everyday. We are standing on a huge source of free energy. The invention of a process to unlock the energy in an atom is not free. Even if fission and fusion energy were made portable it would require tremendous work to contain it in a useable container.

Tesla Technology: Tesla devised technology to capture and retransmit static energy. Energy that is produced by the normal physics of our planet. His greatest technology consisted of basically large capacitors and transmitters. Edison used electromagnetic repulsion and electromagnetic induction to create energy from magnetism. The reason we use Edison technology now is because it was a funding battle. Edison won. The fact that both technologies occurred during the same time-frame indicates that there was no supernatural influence.

Interstellar Travel: There is no way to prove that anything, even a rock, has traveled from star system to star system. Lets say you find a rock that you believe comes from another star system. It comes from the Centari System which is our closest system at only about 4.5 light years. The first thing you must prove is that it is NOT from Earth. To do that you must try to identify the components and verify that they are not known substances. For every substance that is found on Earth the probability of it being extra-terrestrial goes down. But you can't stop there. You must then identify substances that may be from our own Solar system. Since we don't have a library of all the substances within our own star system any unidentified substances make the probability increase while any known extra-terrestrial but known substances again make the probability go down. Then, you are left with unidentified substances that could be from another star system. Without having a library of known substances from other star systems it is improbable that you will be able to identify them. At this point the source of that rock is pure speculation.
I know, you say there is carbon dating and radiation signatures. Proof of the radiation signatures and dating only proves the radiation signatures and age of the rock. Not its journey.
Can you prove I traveled to Washington DC and back? Unless I bring back something that is known to only exist in Washington DC the only thing you can really do is speculate. I can 'say' I went there but really I stopped off in Norfolk, Virginia and never landed foot in Washington DC. I can drive around the block to rack up mileage on my car, I can stay out of sight for the time period needed.
As for space debris that might fall to Earth from another star system even that is unlikely. Sure it has probably happened and will probably happen again but can it be proven? Our star has what is called a heliopause and a shock boundary. Think of it as turgor pressure in a plant cell or you own internal pressure that lets you cope with Earth's atmospheric pressure. Only objects with enough mass can pass thru the boundary. Once they do they are deflected by all sources of gravity encountered during its long journey to our planet surface.
If, keyword, IF, we had a craft that was supposedly from another star system and could study it using today's forensic methods the best we could do would be to confirm it is not from our planet. Even if there were references to star charts and trajectories found within. Even if we found unidentified materials. Without a comparison proof to judge by it's origin is still only speculation.

Anti-gravity Propulsion:
There is a flaw in the very description of this term. Gravity exists everywhere. Our astronauts in space are not in an environment that is free of gravity, they are in micro-gravity. Gravity is even at the the particle scale in atoms. Anti-gravity refers to something opposite of gravity. It is not referring to overcoming micro-gravity. Anti-matter is the opposite of matter.
Overcoming gravity is common. We can do it with a ball. Magnetic repulsion levitates and propels our trains. Our space probes are propelled by gravity but not the absence or opposite of it. Its called gravitational assist.
I am not saying Anti-Gravity is not possible, just improbable. The recently discovered Boson is thought to have a force in the Universe that keeps matter from flying apart (Bose-Einstein Condensate). If the secrets to the Boson were unlocked and could be harnessed into a tool then it could produce something that could negate the affects of gravity. As it is, we need a super-collider just to prove it exists. If we had a craft to study we could not prove that it is/was propelled by so-called anti-gravity. Even if a craft did use anti-gravity as propulsion it would need a gravity field within it to negate the affects on the occupants and the materials needed to maintain the outer field. This would require the ability to create gravity at the atomic level inside an area of anti-gravity. Any matter within the affect of the anti-matter field would fly apart at the atomic/sub-atomic level.
reputable persons from the military
LOL, Show me one reputable person from this planet! Show me anyone that can think in reality without being jaded by any delusions. Just one person that has factual witnessed knowledge of all things possible. A person that is not influenced by others, their own belief system or the misconceptions of ignorance.
I don't care what title they wear, who praises them or how powerful they think they are - everyone (except infants) are jaded by social interactions and ideas, deluded in one way or the other.
 

AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
Tesla Technology: Tesla devised technology to capture and retransmit static energy. Energy that is produced by the normal physics of our planet. His greatest technology consisted of basically large capacitors and transmitters. Edison used electromagnetic repulsion and electromagnetic induction to create energy from magnetism. The reason we use Edison technology now is because it was a funding battle. Edison won. The fact that both technologies occurred during the same time-frame indicates that there was no supernatural influence.
Edison developed DC {direct current} for use in transmission of electricity. Tesla developed AC {alternating current}. Edison was against AC {alternating current} for this use. AC proved to be better and almost all electricity transmitted through power lines is AC. Westinghouse originally funded Tesla but bought him out at some point and made most of the profits for himself.
Edison won in the money game and died wealthy - Tesla died broke and many years after the invention of wireless radio was given credit for being its inventor. When Tesla died the government seized his records and what technology they got from them can only be imagined. Edison was a clever inventor - Tesla was a genius!

"It is paradoxical, yet true, to say, that the more we know, the more ignorant we become in the absolute sense, for it is only through enlightenment that we become conscious of our limitations. Precisely one of the most gratifying results of intellectual evolution is the continuous opening up of new and greater prospects."
-Nikola Tesla

"Every living being is an engine geared to the wheelwork of the universe. Though seemingly affected only by its immediate surrounding, the sphere of external influence extends to infinite distance."
-Nikola Tesla

"With ideas it is like with dizzy heights you climb: At first they cause you discomfort and you are anxious to get down, distrustful of your own powers; but soon the remoteness of the turmoil of life and the inspiring influence of the altitude calm your blood; your step gets firm and sure and you begin to look - for dizzier heights."
-Nikola Tesla

"I do not think there is any thrill that can go through the human heart like that felt by the inventor as he sees some creation of the brain unfolding to success... such emotions make a man forget food, sleep, friends, love, everything."
-Nikola Tesla
 

Kevin

Code Monkey
Staff member
Joined
Mar 20, 2004
Location
Pennsylvania
Seriously?, how so?
That image of Tesla was from the TV series Sanctuary. Tom is having a bit of fun with that one, Tesla appeared on the show as the result of him injecting himself with pure vampire blood in the the 19th century and then went on to be sometimes an ally, sometimes an enemy.
 

AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
Was Nikola Tesla Communicating with Extraterrestrials

Was Nikola Tesla A UFO Contactee?

"Tesla later went public with his claim that he was receiving extraterrestrial voice transmissions and was subjected to the usual humiliating ridicule that greets UFO witnesses today when they try to speak openly of their experiences. But he remained firm in his conviction that the voices were genuine and posed a terrifying threat to life on Earth as we know it.Global Communications publisher Tim Beckley provided more input on the connection between Tesla and UFOs.
"There are many who believe," Beckley said, "that Tesla was actually a ‘star child’ of sorts, that he was born on another planet and left on the doorstep of his adoptive parents. This speculative theory was first offered in a long out-of-print book by Margaret Storm and a later tome by Commander X titled ‘Nikola Tesla: Free Energy and the White Dove.


""The idea that Tesla was born off-planet," Beckley continued, "seems to have originated with a gentleman named Otis T. Carr. A Baltimore Doctor and inventor, Carr claims that he worked side-by-side with Tesla for years and that he discovered bits and pieces of the great inventor’s life that no one else knew about, including the fact that Tesla wasn’t originally from ‘here.’..............."

See whole article here:
http://www.educatinghumanity.com/2011/04/was-nikola-tesla-communicating-with.html

So you see he wasn't a vampire but definitely an alien!!!
 

Kevin

Code Monkey
Staff member
Joined
Mar 20, 2004
Location
Pennsylvania
I suspect that in our modern times if a brilliant scientist came out saying that he heard voices that soon after he would be involuntarily committed to treatment and placed on a cocktail of drugs, not assumed to be an alien life form.
 

AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
I suspect that in our modern times if a brilliant scientist came out saying that he heard voices that soon after he would be involuntarily committed to treatment and placed on a cocktail of drugs, not assumed to be an alien life form.
Believe it or not, and coming from a book I read a couple of years age called "The Stargate Conspiracy", where they were investigating some modern day alien/occult phenomena, supposedly quite a few scientists did believe they had contact with alien intelligence. Writing from my AlienView persona/position I do believe in alien intelligence - It is Human intelligence that remains to be proven!

"I believe alien life is quite common in the universe, although intelligent life is less so.
Some say it has yet to appear on planet Earth.
"
-Stephen Hawking
 

screenersam

This is news, Vincenzo, NEWS!
Joined
Jan 30, 2009
Location
Maryland
slightly off topic...those interested in Tesla may want to check out the book 'Mirage' by Clive Cussler.
http://www.amazon.com/Mirage-Oregon-Files-Clive-Cussler/dp/0425250636/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1424177918&sr=1-1&keywords=mirage+cussler
don't want to give spoilers but do look at the cover.

my understanding is that Tesla started out as a genius nuts-and-bolts mind but started drifting into energy transmission and other increasingly unrealistic ideas. my understanding is that energy transmission is impossible, but he was convinced it would work based on faulty calculations.
can't help but wonder what was in his files
 

AlienView

StarGate Explorer
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
slightly off topic...those interested in Tesla may want to check out the book 'Mirage' by Clive Cussler.
http://www.amazon.com/Mirage-Oregon-Files-Clive-Cussler/dp/0425250636/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1424177918&sr=1-1&keywords=mirage+cussler
don't want to give spoilers but do look at the cover.

my understanding is that Tesla started out as a genius nuts-and-bolts mind but started drifting into energy transmission and other increasingly unrealistic ideas. my understanding is that energy transmission is impossible, but he was convinced it would work based on faulty calculations.
can't help but wonder what was in his files
Not quite - Westinghouse, his financial backer, realized you could not meter energy transferred through the ground and was in no way going to support its development. Tesla's greates weakness was a lack of business acumen
- even back then the rule that money and profit rule was the rule - continues today and science for the most part is based upon profit over all else. We could probably completely meet all the power needs of the Earth with the sun right now {ie. both direct solar electricity and huge solar power generators} but the big profit is in oil - so you keep paying for it!!!
 

Ellyson66

Cadet
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
I have heard a lot and read about Aliens through various books. But I am much more interested to know about them. Does they really exist?
 
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