Sloane and Revenge

[DSR<O>]

What is it about Sloane and revenge? Everytime something hits close to home (Cole & SD-6, Dixon & Emily, Anna & Nadia, Third Faction & APO), he turns into this vengeful madman with a thundercloud on his shoulder. Like someone dug up his mother's grave and spit on her. Don't they know, only Sloane himself is allowed to do that. Come to think of it, anyone who's ever been betrayed or suffered personal loss on this show turns it into a personal vendetta. Sloane just turns vendettas into an art form. Forget about forgiveness. Lesson: don't ever betray a spy. And if you do, don't pick Sloane. And if you do, make sure you have a will written. Scratch that...make sure you don't have a family.

DSR<O>

 

[ChewsterGirl]

Definitely words to take to heart!

Sloane and the rest of the characters' turn to revenge before forgiveness as a general rule because it makes the show more exciting! Where would we be if Syd just said, "Oh, I forgive my mom for shooting me twice and hiring an assasin to kill me!" Or if she said, "Oh, i forgive Sloane for ordering the hit on Danny! I'm sure he meant well!" Or if Vaughn said, "Oh, Syd, I forgive your mom for killing my dad. She's a real nice lady!"



Just teasing ya, by the way. I know there are some examples of forgiveness on the show. Like Syd and Jack. They usually forgive and forget, before the next thing comes up between them!
And Sloane and Jack... they have a very complex and fascinating relationship that is often mending itself before the next rip!

 

[DSR<O>]

Yeah, but when Syd forgives Jack, it's usually because she learned something material that shed new light on Jack's actions, e.g. Irina's contract on Syd's life. Would she have been so forgiving without that knowledge? She hasn't really forgiven Sloane for running SD-6 and fooling the lower level agents. In fact, she's staying at APO just to watch him.

Nadia's vow to avenge her mother may yet turn her against Jack this season.

Sloane ordered Diane's assasination in retribution for Emily's accidental murder.

In retaliation, Dixon tells Syd that he wants "that b*tch Allison dead!" His "I'll be there, I'll be waiting" speech to Sloane at APO clearly shows that Dixon harbors the same grudge against him as Syd.

Vaughn? He was hell bent on wiping Lauren off the face of the planet with acid. Only Katya's intervention stopped it. Even Syd got into that act in the finale of S3.

And who thinks Jack's assasination of Sasha Korchev wasn't personal? After a couple of decades of stewing, Jack derives satisfaction by strangling the traitor with his own hands.

The examples of forgiveness are few and far between. For every instance of forgiveness, there's many more of vengeance fulfilled. That having been said...I do agree though, that revenge over forgiveness is what makes for high TV drama. What would Alias be without it?

DSR<O>

 

[ChewsterGirl]

Yeah, but when Syd forgives Jack, it's usually because she learned something material that shed new light on Jack's actions, e.g. Irina's contract on Syd's life.  Would she have been so forgiving without that knowledge?  She hasn't really forgiven Sloane for running SD-6 and fooling the lower level agents.  In fact, she's staying at APO just to watch him.

Nadia's vow to avenge her mother may yet turn her against Jack this season.

Sloane ordered Diane's assasination in retribution for Emily's accidental murder.

In retaliation, Dixon tells Syd that he wants "that b*tch Allison dead!"  His "I'll be there, I'll be waiting" speech to Sloane at APO clearly shows that Dixon harbors the same grudge against him as Syd.

Vaughn?  He was hell bent on wiping Lauren off the face of the planet with acid.  Only Katya's intervention stopped it.  Even Syd got into that act in the finale of S3.

And who thinks Jack's assasination of Sasha Korchev wasn't personal?  After a couple of decades of stewing, Jack derives satisfaction by strangling the traitor with his own hands.

The examples of forgiveness are few and far between.  For every instance of forgiveness, there's many more of vengeance fulfilled.  That having been said...I do agree though, that revenge over forgiveness is what makes for high TV drama.  What would Alias be without it?   

DSR<O>

[post="1283906"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

Those examples were too great not to quote! But I have some questions. Memory is failing me on the Sasha and Jack thing. What is the back story on that?
Also, just to confirm what I think is the case: Was Katya there to save Lauren? How did she know Vaughn would be after her? Did she just suspect it because of Lauren's betrayal of him?
Nadia still thinks that guy (what's his name?) in Spain murdered Irina, right? because Jack told her that. I wonder how long Sydney will play along. It will be interesting to see how Sydney handles that after Jack betrays her in Nightingale.

 

[DSR<O>]

Those examples were too great not to quote! But I have some questions. Memory is failing me on the Sasha and Jack thing. What is the back story on that?
Also, just to confirm what I think is the case: Was Katya there to save Lauren? How did she know Vaughn would be after her? Did she just suspect it  because of Lauren's betrayal of him?
Nadia still thinks that guy (what's his name?) in Spain murdered Irina, right? because Jack told her that. I wonder how long Sydney will play along. It will be interesting to see how Sydney handles that after Jack betrays her in Nightingale.

[post="1283943"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

Jack taught Sasha all that he knew, and Sasha went rogue, abandoning the CIA (although he claimed that it was the other way around). Jack felt responsible for not having eliminated Sasha many years ago when he had the opportunity.

Katya was there to save Lauren, because she was somehow allied with her, probably both Covenant. As for how she knew where Lauren was...perhaps surveillance? Perhaps a mole? Not sure.

As far as Nadia knows, Martin Bishop was the one who killed Irina, because Jack altered the briefing file. His way of killing two birds. Sydney seems to be playing along just fine, even asking Jack to have dinner. I believe she will only tell Nadia if her sister suspects something and corners her for the truth. Haven't seen the preview for Nightingale, but that may be good, as they give away too much sometimes.

DSR<O>

 

[ChewsterGirl]

Oh right, I remember Sasha now. Yes, it's all coming back! Danke!

Yeah, Bishop, that's the guy.

I guess Sydney figures that Nadia would not understand why Jack had to kill Irina, or have her killed, because Nadia does not know Irina. Nadia's not having any knowledge of how unpredictable this woman was/is (for we don't know for sure Irina is dead!) could be a problem if she discovered the truth. Syd and Jack might try to explain it to her, but who wants to hear that kind of thing about a mother they always dreamed about but never had? Look how long it took Sydney to accept the awful truth! Irina could easily manipulate Nadia, make her feel "maternal love," just like she did with Sydney in S2, and use Nadia to work on her side. Maybe splitting up Sydney and Nadia would be Irina's endgame! Maybe that's what Irina would want, to turn her daughters against each other, so the Rambaldi prophecy could come true. What do you think?

 

[DSR<O>]

Irina could easily manipulate Nadia, make her feel "maternal love," just like she did with Sydney in S2, and use Nadia to work on her side. Maybe splitting up Sydney and Nadia would be Irina's endgame! Maybe that's what Irina would want, to turn her daughters against each other, so the Rambaldi prophecy could come true. What do you think?

[post="1285555"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

That sounds exactly like something Irina would do, except the producers may never be able to lure her back. In her stead, perhaps Sloane or Bill will do the same. It could even be that the pact between Jack and Sloane will be sundered, resulting in all-out war between spydaddies, and the sisters would be forced to take sides against each other to defend their respective fathers. Actually, the more I think about that, the more it makes sense. I believe the symmetry between spy sisters, spy dads, and the Rambaldi symbol is no accident. The question remains though: what is the circular object in the middle of the Rambaldi symbol that the two sides will battle over?

DSR<O>

 

[ChewsterGirl]

I doubt Bill Vaughn will be or might be the one to encourage the battle between the sisters. Sloane would do it because Rambaldi is his life. It was/is Bill's life too but the whole reason Irina had to kill Bill (haha, Kill Bill) was because he tried to hide Nadia from the other Rambaldi nuts. For once, because he pitied little Nadia, he chose to put a child's happiness before the Rambaldi obsession. I have a hard time believing he would suddenly just *not give a damn* about Nadia and surrender her happiness again (by ruining her relationship with her sister) for the sake of Rambaldi. I could be wrong of course. Maybe Bill won't feel as obligated to protect Nadia's happiness now that she's an adult, but I doubt it.

 

[DSR<O>]

I don't believe we know enough about Bill to assume that he saved Nadia for altruistic reasons. If you recall, Bill's journal was filled with many mathematical equations and diagrams, reminiscent of those who hunt for Rambaldi's works. Plus, Frank Murdoch's character description of Bill was, shall we say...not too kind? It could be that Bill wanted to allow her the chance to grow up and then do battle with Sydney in order to fulfill the prophecy, as he saw it. There appears to be several factions obsessed with Rambaldi and not all of them are on the same page (pun intended). Some of them could interpret the prophecy very differently. Even Jack could be one of said factions. Anyway, I was just throwing out names, because when it comes to Alias, no one is totally above suspicion. By the way, have you seen my APO Mole Theory?

 

[ChewsterGirl]

I do recall voting in a poll about who might be the APO mole. I think I voted that Nadia would be. what is your theory? what thread is it and where is it in the forum? i would love to read it but i don't remember where the poll is.
I agree we don't know enough about Bill, and actually, after we learned about his actions in the Falklands (or supposedly his) it's difficult to vouch for his character either way. His son would wish to believe the best, true, but you're right. The eyewitnesses who knew Bill best, who remember with objective minds about his Rambaldi obsession, would be better equipped, perhaps, to judge his true reason for hiding nadia. it might be that Bill tried to keep Irina or Sloane from Nadia because he wanted to be the one to know where she was, how she might learn of her prophetic importance, and he would be able to thus control the situation.

 

[DSR<O>]

I do recall voting in a poll about who might be the APO mole. I think I voted that Nadia would be. what is your theory? what thread is it and where is it in the forum? i would love to read it but i don't remember where the poll is.

[post="1288037"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

The thread is in Season 4, A Man of His Word forum: Mole in APO?

My Mole Theory is lower down in the thread, post #10. It's somewhat long(winded). Brace yourself. :blink: :lol:

DSR<O>

 

[ChewsterGirl]

The thread is in Season 4, A Man of His Word forum: Mole in APO?

My Mole Theory is lower down in the thread, post #10.  It's somewhat long(winded).  Brace yourself.  :blink:  :lol:

DSR<O>

[post="1288045"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

WHEW, boy was that a theory! I replied to it in said thread. It is far-fetched and MS suggested that maybe Marshall is being brainwashed, but your Anna/tracking device point was great, and your theory made me recall that security system chick that Syd and Weiss captured in Season Trois. Remember when she offered Marshall a job? He turned her down, but what if he later considered her words? (More money might tempt a new daddy and hard-working husband!)

 

[ms.katejones]

I'm gonna guess Sloane is gonna want mad revenge on his Clone, anyone else agree? (Unless of course the crazy guy is working with the Faux Arvin.)

 

[Osiris]

I'm gonna guess Sloane is gonna want mad revenge on his Clone, anyone else agree? (Unless of course the crazy guy is working with the Faux Arvin.)

[post="1301908"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

yea, i can see our Sloane being pissed off at his clone, and yea, i could see him getting so pissed off that he would kill the guy.

 

[Gadgett]

yea, i can see our Sloane being pissed off at his clone, and yea, i could see him getting so pissed off that he would kill the guy.

[post="1304061"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

That's going to be some confrontation when the two Sloanes finally meet. I can't wait to see it.