Morneblade
Cadet
Cut scenes are cool, one of the things I really liked in GW. I'm not sure how they would do it with all the customization ingame though. But I think it would be a huge plus.
F
frostydf2
Guest
I agree, when you engage in a boss mob you should have a change in music. A faster-paced theme, with more action to it
Wonderwhat
Cadet
Watching some of those E3 videos and then seeing this thread i thought i might share my idea for a fun "Boss" battle. In some of the videos they showed seige weapons (catapults), and a small dragon or drake or something.
Now what if you have a large Dragon that doesn't stay in the same place perhaps it moves from mountain to mountain and from plain to plain hunting it's meals. The way you kill this dragon is by finding it's favorite hunting ground, then set a trap like a bloody mess of slaughtered cattle parts that no one wants. Then you set up seige weapons out of sight. Then use the seige weapons to hurt it enough to keep it from flying away and hopefully injure it enough to be able to finish it off.
I know that many of these things people wouldn't be able to do so again i have an idea for that.
This is a multi-step quest, when you begin this quest the first step is to get the materials for the siege weapons, blinds to hide the seige weapons, perhaps the dragon likes a Ukar...so you get ukar parts, and then finally you perhaps recruit some well known NPC's to help you out.
I think if this was implemented correctly this could be very exciting.
I also like the 8 guardian and sleeping guy idea. Oh and Daax i'm with ya on the FFVI style boss music.
Now what if you have a large Dragon that doesn't stay in the same place perhaps it moves from mountain to mountain and from plain to plain hunting it's meals. The way you kill this dragon is by finding it's favorite hunting ground, then set a trap like a bloody mess of slaughtered cattle parts that no one wants. Then you set up seige weapons out of sight. Then use the seige weapons to hurt it enough to keep it from flying away and hopefully injure it enough to be able to finish it off.
I know that many of these things people wouldn't be able to do so again i have an idea for that.
This is a multi-step quest, when you begin this quest the first step is to get the materials for the siege weapons, blinds to hide the seige weapons, perhaps the dragon likes a Ukar...so you get ukar parts, and then finally you perhaps recruit some well known NPC's to help you out.
I think if this was implemented correctly this could be very exciting.
I also like the 8 guardian and sleeping guy idea. Oh and Daax i'm with ya on the FFVI style boss music.
I love the idea of the party being the boss and 50+ npc attack you.
An encounter I would also like to see. Similar events I have seen in games but these are the types that entertain me; I will be general just for descriptive purposes.
NoteX has random chance to drop off local brigand type mobs (could also be a quest). NoteX has description of witch and friends hidden in mountain. There are 3 different notes and 3 different possible entrances to the mountain (instance). Depending on which NoteX you have and the number of people you bring will determine the difficulty and strategy used. I will give 2 examples but there are many more.
Example 1. 3 different notes are found by 3 good companions all referencing a witch in a mountain but all are a bit different. The 3 friends confer and decide to take a stab and putting the old hag out of her misery. All together the notes provide much detail and a very safe plan is devised. All 3 will lead a party of 5 thru their respective secret doors. Group 1 and 2 will intentionally set of the alarms to force the witch to deploy her guards in different directions. Group 3 will have a rogue to disable the traps along their route and will reach the witch undetected. Group 3 dispatches the witch (I want to make clear at this point grp 3’s fight is relatively easy as it is 5 vs 1 and they had the surprise.) Once the witch is dead all of he minions dissipate. Loot up zone out.
Example 2. 1 note is found by serious player guild officer 07. He would like his armies to squash this menace immediately. His note lacks certain trap local and specifications but does detail killing the witch will disperse her minions. He takes 40 of his loyal troops thru his secret door and although a good rogue brought along might detect some of the traps they are eventually noticed. Being only 1 intrusion the witch teleports all 40 to her chamber and it becomes a mighty battle.
A few things to consider. The witch’s x# of main guards are really the only raid bosses so in example 2 the have to be fought and they are hard. In example 1 they are bypassed if grp 3 downs the witch before grp 1 and grp 2 have to actually fight them (sounding multiple alarms would give them waves of mobs leading to the 2 big guards.)
I would like to see the name of the witch, loc of the traps detailed, and the actual loc for the instance zone-in change often. To keep the raid based off actually reading the notes and not just going to www.mmogodstrats.com. Also I would like for every 5 people that zone in there are (x/5)-1 main guards. Of course once a note is used by a player, that player may never find another note.
Sry this is getting long, but there are many options and ways to approach the fight. The main point is let 15 people do it jus like 40 could do it; they just have to plan/coordinate better and would take a bit longer to aquire 3 notes instead of 1.
An encounter I would also like to see. Similar events I have seen in games but these are the types that entertain me; I will be general just for descriptive purposes.
NoteX has random chance to drop off local brigand type mobs (could also be a quest). NoteX has description of witch and friends hidden in mountain. There are 3 different notes and 3 different possible entrances to the mountain (instance). Depending on which NoteX you have and the number of people you bring will determine the difficulty and strategy used. I will give 2 examples but there are many more.
Example 1. 3 different notes are found by 3 good companions all referencing a witch in a mountain but all are a bit different. The 3 friends confer and decide to take a stab and putting the old hag out of her misery. All together the notes provide much detail and a very safe plan is devised. All 3 will lead a party of 5 thru their respective secret doors. Group 1 and 2 will intentionally set of the alarms to force the witch to deploy her guards in different directions. Group 3 will have a rogue to disable the traps along their route and will reach the witch undetected. Group 3 dispatches the witch (I want to make clear at this point grp 3’s fight is relatively easy as it is 5 vs 1 and they had the surprise.) Once the witch is dead all of he minions dissipate. Loot up zone out.
Example 2. 1 note is found by serious player guild officer 07. He would like his armies to squash this menace immediately. His note lacks certain trap local and specifications but does detail killing the witch will disperse her minions. He takes 40 of his loyal troops thru his secret door and although a good rogue brought along might detect some of the traps they are eventually noticed. Being only 1 intrusion the witch teleports all 40 to her chamber and it becomes a mighty battle.
A few things to consider. The witch’s x# of main guards are really the only raid bosses so in example 2 the have to be fought and they are hard. In example 1 they are bypassed if grp 3 downs the witch before grp 1 and grp 2 have to actually fight them (sounding multiple alarms would give them waves of mobs leading to the 2 big guards.)
I would like to see the name of the witch, loc of the traps detailed, and the actual loc for the instance zone-in change often. To keep the raid based off actually reading the notes and not just going to www.mmogodstrats.com. Also I would like for every 5 people that zone in there are (x/5)-1 main guards. Of course once a note is used by a player, that player may never find another note.
Sry this is getting long, but there are many options and ways to approach the fight. The main point is let 15 people do it jus like 40 could do it; they just have to plan/coordinate better and would take a bit longer to aquire 3 notes instead of 1.
JonDDA
Cadet
SO many good ideas.
I agree, bosses shouldnt just be, *hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit DEAD*
It should be EPIC, Fast paced music, different ways of killing, different strategies.
You should be able to split up the party and go seperate ways to do multiple things at once, but it would be harder with less numbers. There shoudlnt be a linear path and plot for bosses.
Like Sader said. If your in an enemy stronghold, and your main goal is to kill big baddy number one, and the guards arent near, you should be able to split up, one group hold off the gaurds, the others kill big baddy. Make it an EPIC STRUGGLE, not just the lame-ity of the current MMO's. Make it fun!
And the music should get our blood pumping, get us excited, or be UBER CREEPY.
Example: Undead spider cave, big baddy is an undead Necromancer with 20 elite skeletons.
The pawn spiders and skeletons attack your party as you get split up in the maze of tunnels, wich smell of death and decay and are riddled with bones and web.
One party falls through trap set in the floor and fall into a room filled with ghouls. The music they hear would be high pitched screams with violins screeching in the background.
While the main party still meandering through the tunnels would hear a drum beating...over...and over...with some tension building music. Finally, the whole group meets up at an old battered bloodstained wooden door, adorned with skulls and green slime.
You open the door and screams of pain and anger fill the cave. Once it subsides your surrounded by the skeletons as the necromancer makes the corpses around you explode.
PURE CHAOS!
Thats what a Boss encounter should be like.
Anyone agree?
I agree, bosses shouldnt just be, *hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit hit DEAD*
It should be EPIC, Fast paced music, different ways of killing, different strategies.
You should be able to split up the party and go seperate ways to do multiple things at once, but it would be harder with less numbers. There shoudlnt be a linear path and plot for bosses.
Like Sader said. If your in an enemy stronghold, and your main goal is to kill big baddy number one, and the guards arent near, you should be able to split up, one group hold off the gaurds, the others kill big baddy. Make it an EPIC STRUGGLE, not just the lame-ity of the current MMO's. Make it fun!
And the music should get our blood pumping, get us excited, or be UBER CREEPY.
Example: Undead spider cave, big baddy is an undead Necromancer with 20 elite skeletons.
The pawn spiders and skeletons attack your party as you get split up in the maze of tunnels, wich smell of death and decay and are riddled with bones and web.
One party falls through trap set in the floor and fall into a room filled with ghouls. The music they hear would be high pitched screams with violins screeching in the background.
While the main party still meandering through the tunnels would hear a drum beating...over...and over...with some tension building music. Finally, the whole group meets up at an old battered bloodstained wooden door, adorned with skulls and green slime.
You open the door and screams of pain and anger fill the cave. Once it subsides your surrounded by the skeletons as the necromancer makes the corpses around you explode.
PURE CHAOS!
Thats what a Boss encounter should be like.
Anyone agree?
Morneblade
Cadet
I'm with Jon on this one, lets do something different and make the cumulation of a quest a big deal. It needs to feel, look and sound Epic and Heroic. One of my problems with most other games is that most of your content seeems second rate in comparison to high end stuff.
It shouldn't
Am I going to be fighting Dragons and Gods at lvl 1? No.
But My fist quest should feel heroic, be worth while and give my character a sence of doing some real good and accomplishment. So I only stopped a local Bandit from robbing travelers on the road. But make him a very accomplished bandit, one that was giving the guards fits for years. You don't have to change the world to be heroic. But you do have to make a difference where others couldn't and you need to feel like what you did was important.
I just don't want to start out by beating on rats.......again....... <_<
It shouldn't
Am I going to be fighting Dragons and Gods at lvl 1? No.
But My fist quest should feel heroic, be worth while and give my character a sence of doing some real good and accomplishment. So I only stopped a local Bandit from robbing travelers on the road. But make him a very accomplished bandit, one that was giving the guards fits for years. You don't have to change the world to be heroic. But you do have to make a difference where others couldn't and you need to feel like what you did was important.
I just don't want to start out by beating on rats.......again....... <_<
PrestoAdam
Cadet
Don't know about that overlord fellow, but Ony became pretty easy after the 30th time or so.
This brings up a good point though. More important than having a boss that is hard to kill, is one that we do not have to kill over and over.
I would really like to see at least some random dungeon generation with random boss encounters.
Morneblade
Cadet
More importantly, lets not be required to farm or raid.
I would like to see some randomness with dungeons though, so if you have done a quest before with another party, unexpected things will happen. If everything is going to be handcrafted I can see where this would not be possible, but maybe change where ecnounters take place.
Also lets see about having instanced quests scale to the party size.
Raiding like WoW's end game is the worst... I'd much rather log on my level 50's in Dark Age of Camelot and storm keeps, dark spire & dungeons (mind: Gaheris, so RvR isn't end game for the server).
I would like to see events, of course this is HJ ... and we've been reassured of GM run events for everyone. So I'm happy there.
~ Jaraeth
I would like to see events, of course this is HJ ... and we've been reassured of GM run events for everyone. So I'm happy there.
~ Jaraeth
F
frostydf2
Guest
I actually enjoy raids in WoW. I don't see the big problem with them. Why not have them?
Morneblade
Cadet
There are alot of reasons why I dont think we need Raiding in the game Frosty. First, raiding has been beat to death. Out of the dozens of MMO's I have either played or beta tested, almost all of them have this as your endgame. EQ, EQ2, WoW, L1, L2, CoH, DAoC (ToA expantion, which ruined the game) and the list goes on and on. Many yet to be released games will have raiding in Spades as well. Look at Vanguard. Raiding has been the endgame in almost every major MMO since EQ. If I wanted to Raid, I have more than enough games to choose from. Lets get some variety.
2nd, I think (ok, I KNOW) it is the single bigest timesink in MMO's and anything that is a timesink is exploitable by powergamers. Anything that requires large numbers of people to spend 10+ hours doing is going to cut out the majority of players. Now, if it was something you only had to do once, it would be a bit different, but the fact of the matter is you generally have to farm a "boss" many times to get soemthing you "want" off of it. And that is of course not counting the times you wipe trying to figure out how to kill him. So, multiply the 10 hour thingie by 30. 300 hours to get 1 item. If you are lucky.
Raiding in the way it has been done in the past it strickly a powergamer only activity. To advance your character, you are required to "farm" Raid bosses countless times to get equipment. That is basically the only thing you can do that is remotly meaningful in almost every MMO on the market. This is so wrong on so many levels it make me sick. I've been forced to raid for nearly 10 years, and its evil. And don't even think about bringing a "unrequired class".
And how is being a cog in the "raid machine" Heroic anyways? It would be alot more "heroic" to take a small party of "real" heroes into a similar dungeon than a army of pie-eyed pissants to clear a dungeon in 10 hours and beat on a boss for 30 minutes. SO heroic that is. <_<
A couple of things I wonder about (and this is not a flame, but a real question) if you eliminated uber loot from raids, would you still be interested in raiding? Personally I have done raids (where I was in the mindset that I'm doing this for fun) and they can be fun, once in a blue moon. However, if I'm going to be forced to raid 5 times a week for a few months to get gear I need to compete in other parts of the game, I'll quit that game faster than you can blink.
Raiding can be fun at times. However don't give any special drops from it, don't make it the focus of the game at anytime, and as Seeria mentioned maybe have it important in a storyline or Event.
But lets face it, in most MMO's it is an absolute REQUIRMENT.
As good as HJ looks right now, if it ends up being the focus of HJ at the end, and it becomes "required" because the Wyr drops are the best in the game (as in 99% of othere MMO's) I'll drop HJ like a hot patootie.
Morneblade
Cadet
For me ( and I think most people that play MMO's) Raiding is defined as attacking a Major boss with several groups repeatedly untill you are able to get the drops that you "require" so you can go after the next "boss" that has even bettter gear. Bosses that must be "pharmed" for "ph4t l3w7".
A one time, story advancing or Event is not a "raid".
JonDDA
Cadet
Figuring out how to take down a raid boss in WoW would be fun, but stressful and require a lot of time, but if you had a tight knit group of friends it was more fun than anything else.
I think there should be raiding, but it shouldnt be 40 manned. Like I said in my previous post, it should be a small party with many options of how to finish it.
There shouldnt be a lot of drop options, it should be very unique items.
Back to my example of the necromance, the item he should drop should be what he is wearing. And Dungeons shouldnt be farmable, once you clear it, either its cleared for good, the second in command takes over, or some other group takes over.
It should be fun trying to figure out how to take a dungeon, but it shouldnt take A LOT OF TIME.
I think there should be raiding, but it shouldnt be 40 manned. Like I said in my previous post, it should be a small party with many options of how to finish it.
There shouldnt be a lot of drop options, it should be very unique items.
Back to my example of the necromance, the item he should drop should be what he is wearing. And Dungeons shouldnt be farmable, once you clear it, either its cleared for good, the second in command takes over, or some other group takes over.
It should be fun trying to figure out how to take a dungeon, but it shouldnt take A LOT OF TIME.
