Season 4 this is getting dumb

amandamanda6

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Is it just me or is this whole vaughn not being vaughn thing kinda just pushing it over the edge? i mean there are sooo many characters who arent what they seem that its just .. as a audience you never believe anything anymore? I dunno, I think vaughn should have a less.... big secret.. like i got arrested when i was 17 for drunk driving or something not like "i am not who u think we are but we are about to go alope" i mean come on... and if he was so nervous to ask sydney to marry him.. and he waited so long for the right moment... why would he just say that his name is not vaughn randomly in a car. wouldnt u think he would prepare her a lil... like hey syd i need to tell u something.. this is going to be a shock but i still love you.. etc etc... and now vaughn will probably be in a coma for a while, why sydney doesnt know whether she loves him anymore (poor girl doesnt know who to trust anymore) and then once shes ok she will be frantically looking for clues to vaughns past. will probably find out.. go through rocky times.. then maybe they will finally marry... but i think that if they just got married.. i would have been more happy

oh yeah, and i jumped like feet in the air when they crashed... it seemed so real.

-amanda

p.s. i just joined this forum but like 3 weeks ago i won a signed copy of hte pilot episode script at an auction!!! i was sooo excited! and i also got an alias magazine signed by jjabrams with the auction! woot!
 

xsydneyx

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Welcome to the Neighbourhood. And congrats on your winnings.

I agree with you, they have kind of taken this too far, but think about it.. what if this clears everything up?
I mean, this could explain everything.. Bill Vaughn, Irina, Elena, Sloane.. everything! Maybe having ex-Vaughn being more involved will help us make sense of Syd's beginning.
Though, I still can't figure out why he'd tell her in the car. That was dumb. And was the accident, well, accidental? Or was it planned... like everything else seems to be on this show?
I totally jumped too. Two of my friends screamed... it was funny.

Take a look at some of the speculation as to who Vaughn really is. It might make you less disappointed.
 

Jamison

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Oh sweetie, I agree.

I was in shock...and I still am (I thought I was going to be sick).

One of the main reasons was because not only do they do this to everyone, but we haven't gotten any indication that Vaughn was bad or secretly working for someone else. Especially in season 1. It doesn't make sense. There are so many unanswered questions...like his dad. Obviously his dad had a made up name...because people at the CIA would know if Vaughn was Bill's son or not...so does that mean that Bill was working for someone else too? And what about the loving my country and I would never betray them felgercarb...it doesn't add up at all.

It seems like this was thrown out there to be shocking. I'm just hoping that JJ knows what he's doing and this won't be glossed over next season.

But I would've been so much happier if the ending scene was them getting married...I love my Sydney and Vaughn :cry:
 
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I liked the ending. Yes, it was a bit shocking and unexpected, but it was pretty cool.

Nobody would have expected Vaughn to be hiding something this big....
 

Jamison

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Leslie said:
lol that's JJ and his uncreative mind. :LOL: man he is just terrible. I mean, come on! Terrible. Idiot, really. lol hoo boy...
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I completely agree. This was just thrown out there to be shocking, and I'm not convinced he has somewhere to go with it.

Kind of like the end of season 2 where Vaughn got married...

If we had been given reasons to believe that Vaughn was bad, then sure, go with it...but we haven't. This wasn't planned well...at least it doesn't look that way right now.
 

AliasRanger

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Jamison said:
Oh sweetie, I agree.

I was in shock...and I still am (I thought I was going to be sick).

One of the main reasons was because not only do they do this to everyone, but we haven't gotten any indication that Vaughn was bad or secretly working for someone else.  Especially in season 1.  It doesn't make sense.  There are so many unanswered questions...like his dad.  Obviously his dad had a made up name...because people at the CIA would know if Vaughn was Bill's son or not...so does that mean that Bill was working for someone else too?  And what about the loving my country and I would never betray them felgercarb...it doesn't add up at all.

It seems like this was thrown out there to be shocking.  I'm just hoping that JJ knows what he's doing and this won't be glossed over next season.

But I would've been so much happier if the ending scene was them getting married...I love my Sydney and Vaughn :cry:
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I'm glad you're not a writer for the show, or I wouldn't have watched past the pilot.

It seems the fans on this board aren't really fans as much as they are "fickle". Alias fans, who hated season 3 for the fickle reason of "Lauren got between Syd and vaghn!", and then say they love the season afterwards. I won't be suprised if people end up refuting this too.

People have no faith in this show anymore. I'd like to see somebody else come up with something better, but anytime they do, it's something like "I was arrested when I was 17 and that makes me one of the bad guys!"

In the end it's just a television show. People screamed? Got physically sick? I'd say that's a sign of excellent writing. I can't wait to see what happens next season!

-AR.

PS- for those who don't feel well, feel better.
 

gypsy_silk

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People, people, Vaughn didn't say he was working for anybody else. Nor did he say he was bad. He said it depended on your perspective.

They've also made two very non-subtle efforts to compare Vaughn to Jack. First, Jack said vaughn was a lot like him and worried that that was a limitation on V's ability to make Syd happy. Well, we all know that Jack often does bad things for the sake of a good cause, and that this upsets Syd. If Vaughn is the same way it would obviously cause problems.

Irina made the second comparison, when she warned vaughn that he and Syd could end up like her and Jack. In this case Vaughn could be like Irina or like Jack - both are people who do both good and bad things but who are basically good.

And when he said "my name isn't Michael Vaughn" perhaps he just meant his first name or something? That might be lame, but then again, if he was trying to make a break with his past he might have started goign by his middle name or something. Granted, I think that was unlikely. But still.

And the whole "there's a reason that when you first came from SD-6 I was the one you talked to" thing . . . that could go either way, good or bad. he could have been a triple agent for SD-6. (Again I'm stretching here.) He could have been DSR imbedded in CIA. That would make sense - he has a rambaldi connection.

Anyway, I don't think the writers are going to completely throw out canon as some people are afraid. They've just built up too much of history w/ Vaughn - he and Weiss as college buddies, his father's death, and so on and so on. I think more likely we are just going to get supplemental info rather than alternative info - in other words instead of being a Boy Scout Vaughn will become a more complex man.

I was a serious doubter after season 3, (and I've been watching it from season 1) but they've really pulled it together this season. I have faith!!
 

Jamison

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AliasRanger said:
I'm glad you're not a writer for the show, or I wouldn't have watched past the pilot.

It seems the fans on this board aren't really fans as much as they are "fickle". Alias fans, who hated season 3 for the fickle reason of "Lauren got between Syd and vaghn!", and then say they love the season afterwards. I won't be suprised if people end up refuting this too.

People have no faith in this show anymore. I'd like to see somebody else come up with something better, but anytime they do, it's something like "I was arrested when I was 17 and that makes me one of the bad guys!"

In the end it's just a television show. People screamed? Got physically sick? I'd say that's a sign of excellent writing. I can't wait to see what happens next season!

-AR.

PS- for those who don't feel well, feel better.
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I'm definitely a fan...always have been.

I don't know if anyone can deny that this came from out of the blue. Sure there are supposed to be unanswered questions, and that's fine...but couldn't we have gotten hints? That makes sense. If Vaughn was working for bad guys, you think we would've known. It seems so out of charcter, that it's not realistic. Sloane being bad...can buy that. Jack having an evil streak...can buy that too. Lauren being bad, the same. Irinia being bad, of course I can buy that. But Vaughn? It just seems like too much of a stretch.

And as far as season 3 goes, I didn't like it then and I still don't. Not just because Lauren got in between Syd and Vaughn, but they changed Vaughn's character around to a point that wasn't necessary (he became too much of a jerk). And made Sydney this whiny girl who cried all the time...not the strong self sufficient girl we'd grown accustomed too.

The reason I have a problem with it is because it doesn't make any sense. I can look past it hurting Syd and Vaughn...fine. But it's completely out of character. Vaughn wasn't written as a guy who would betray his country...you can see that from the very beginning...now all of a sudden he is, and Irinia knows about it?

It doesn't add up.

And I don't know if good writing has anything to do with it...just the fact that it was shocking...and right now makes absolutely no sense.


While, yes, we don't know for sure whether he worked for the bad guys or not...would it really have been that hard to tell Syd that he worked for two sets of good guys? Probably not...I think since it was kept all hush hush, I think it's pretty safe to say that he was working for someone the CIA would not want him working for.
 
A

AliasALIAS

Guest
I agree with Jamie. Sure, there are questions about Vaughn's past, his family, secrets. Enough questions to make a good season finale nd a new direction for next season. But having a different name? That's a bit of a stretch. It brings up too many questions that seem so random, out of the blue. Bill Vaughn had quite a reputation with the CIA and many agents recognized Michael as his son. Does that mean Bill Vaughn was just an alias? If both Bill and Michael used an alias, we'd assume that they shared some motive together. Yet Michael doesn't even know much about his own father other than the fact that he loved him. Vaughn didn't know how he died until season one, or that he was involved with Rambaldi. When Arvin Clone was playing mind games with him, he questioned his father even more. So how can Vaughn have a secret identity that his father must have known about when he didn't really know his father at all?

And why now? The Vaughns have a cloudy history, so I have no problem with Vaughn hiding some secrets. But we haven't been given any clues that Michael Vaughn's a bad guy, other than bad skill with his relationships. Vaughn didn't meet Sydney by accident. Perhaps it involves Rambaldi since Irina seems to know the secret, and remember the watch from his father that stopped the day he met Sydney? But again, Vaughn didn't even know about his father's involvement with Rambaldi, and he didn't seem much of a believer in Rambaldi himself.

Maybe Bill has absolutely nothing to do with Vaughn's secret. Vaughn could be working for someone else or himself. But he's never seemed to have an ulterior motive. He's never worked for anyone else. Like his father, he was a company guy. The only times he ever defied the CIA were to handle matters that were personal to him. And even then, he still turned out to be a good guy because that's always been his character.

Another possibility is a covert mission assigned to him by the CIA. But yet again, there have been no hints that he had a secondary objective with the CIA, and it still doesn't explain why he has a different last name from his father. Unless he meant to continue, "My name isn't really Michael Vaughn... It's Bruce Vaughn."

Remember after the season 2 finale, many fans believed the "it was all a dream" theory? The major flaw with that is the writers would have absolutely failed if, after two successful years of a show, they say, "Surprise, the past two years never happened. The show is starting over from day 1." No we find ourselves with a character we didn't know about hiding behind a character that we have known for four years--six years in Alias time. That character could completely change as a result of this episode. It's as if the writers wrote the first forty minutes of the episode and then decided, "Hey, we need a cliffhanger. Let's change someone's name."

Maybe the secret's not that big. Maybe Vaughn will still be in character. Maybe he's still a good guy from our perspective. Maybe we're worrying too much. So why end the season with it?

I'm sure Vaughn still, for the most part, is a good guy. And one thing for sure is that he loves Sydney. But I don't like the way they're shaking up his character.
 

AliasRanger

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Jamison said:
And as far as season 3 goes, I didn't like it then and I still don't.  Not just because Lauren got in between Syd and Vaughn, but they changed Vaughn's character around to a point that wasn't necessary (he became too much of a jerk).  And made Sydney this whiny girl who cried all the time...not the strong self sufficient girl we'd grown accustomed too.

[post="1355978"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

Boy I called that one.

If you had it all, and then had it all taken away, I doubt you'd still be this strong person. Vaughn had a wife who he had commitments to.

Characters change, over episodes and over seasons.

fickle fickle.

-AR.
 

AgentDerevko

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May 23, 2005
Needless to say that I was COMPLETLY and UTTERLY shocked at the end but I knew that there would be some extreme large cliffhanger and then BAM there it was.

After thinking about it last night and this morning I have a small theory. Maybe Vaughn isn't "necessarialy" a bad guy. Maybe he is part of the Rambaldi followers but chose not to get the tattoo and his mission is to protect The Chosen One.

The whole car accident thing could have been a Sark attack as well... you know no one ever disappears from Alias. Anna Espinosa came back, Irina came back, Rambaldi never leaves, Sloane is there, therefore Sark can't be out of the picture yet.

This doesn't ruin the S/V plot it deepens it and common... you knew deep down that something would come between Syd and Vaughn. JJ is so good at that.
 
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There could have been a "bug" in thier car and someone does not want Vaughn to tell Syd the truth. What if Vaughn's father hit thier car?
I think that Vaughn will be in coma or something all of next season. Syd will be pregnant with his baby while he is in a coma. Syd will spend the whole next season trying to figure out what hell Vaughn was talking about. Of course Irina knows the truth ans Syd will have to track her down somehow.
 

Seanman2326

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There really aren't THAT many people who arn't what they seem to be...I mean obviously the random guest stars who play the bad guys some times start out seeming to be good but in the end they turn out to be some one else that is a given. Alias is a SPY DRAMA...you are bound to be dealing with people who aren't what they seem ALL THE TIME. I think that the Vaughn not being who he really seems to be is a great addition to the story and it was an awesoem cliffhanger. He's obviously not out to KILL HER or any stupid felgercarb like that or Irina wouldn't have let Vaughn live I'm sure of that. He just has a dark secret...something I've honestly been waiting to see come from Vaughn since the show started!
 

xsydneyx

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The whole point of character development is just that.. change and development.
Think about it, you woke up after what seems like 1 night to find out that your boyfriend got married to another woman, you have no memory of the last two years, and your father is in prison. I'd say that justifies "whining".
Syd's human, we can't forget that. Love is important to her.
I liked Season 3. It had Sark, and, well, SARK!
We found out a lot about Syd's past, Nadia was introduced, Sloane was made even more complex and Lauren was the Super-Mega-Ultra-b****. For the record, I was quite fond of her character. I think Melissa George played her convincingly. Ok, the personality of the character sucked (hence the title I gave her) but the acting was fantastic, her concept was great.
But since this isn't a board about Lauren, I'll move on.
Who knows what JJ is up to, but he hasn't let us down yet. Maybe when we learn who not-Vaughn actually is, it will tie-up a bunch of loose-ends.
Relax, take a deep breath, and have faith that JJ will give us a great explanation in the fall. cause you know he will.
 

rachievaughn

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Oh but his name! I loved that name, its the one i scribbled on my text books when in high school, with a big love heart around it....and now s/v is s/?
URGH! I'm going to call him Michael Vaughn forever, i don't care what they say.
And the thing is, Michael Vaughn is a play on his real name - Michael Vartan.....so i think this whole diff-name thing must have been really unplanned......hmph
 

spy_girl21

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I admit I was shocked with the cliffhanger this season. But it really doesn't make sense, due to the fact of knowing enough about Vaughn's past that you could practically write a short biography for him. In the 1st and 2nd season he seemed to have a genuine heart in helping Sydney. I feel sorry for Sydney because no one is in her life that she can exactly trust, except maybe Weiss(I would say Nadia, but she hasn't exactly been through all of what has happened in the past 4 seasons, and she's in the hospital). But then watch they'll probably complicate Weiss's character and say that he works for the Russian Mafia. Though I guess I don't know what to expect for a show that is heading into it's fifth season, where they're running into dead ends.
 

AliasRanger

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spy_girl21 said:
I admit I was shocked with the cliffhanger this season. But it really doesn't make sense, due to the fact of knowing enough about Vaughn's past that you could practically write a short biography for him. In the 1st and 2nd season he seemed to have a genuine heart in helping Sydney. I feel sorry for Sydney because no one is in her life that she can exactly trust, except maybe Weiss(I would say Nadia, but she hasn't exactly been through all of what has happened in the past 4 seasons, and she's in the hospital). But then watch they'll probably complicate Weiss's character and say that he works for the Russian Mafia.  Though I guess I don't know what to expect for a show that is heading into it's fifth season, where they're running into dead ends.
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Dead ends, huh? This opens up more possibilities than anything.

Arguing it's a bad movie because it'll contradict everything we know about Vaughn's life is a pretty weak argument too, for extremely obvious reasons. You don't know what's going to happen, so the best bet is to wait for season 5.
 

happynow

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Yeah, I don't think Vaughn would tell Sydney in a car. That's one of things making me not believe this thing. And the whole searching for his father thing confuses me too.
 

Jamison

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happynow said:
Yeah, I don't think Vaughn would tell Sydney in a car. That's one of things making me not believe this thing. And the whole searching for his father thing confuses me too.
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The more I think about the more I think it's a dream. But, I think it is Vaughn having the dream, dreading telling Sydney about his secret. So I don't think they'll gloss over this next season...but instead focus on having him tell Syd about his past.
 
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