:lol: I think many of the people here who have been in previous abortion threads know that i'm VERY pro-choice. And to some extent, I do understand the pro-life argument but I cannot accept it. And it does vary from person to person. I really wasnt' brought up with a religion or belief (mind you, I still get good grades, still a virgin, doesn't do drugs or anything illegal :lol: ) nor did my parents really put up a moral fence for me to look up at, so basically what I do believe is derived from what I've learned over the years and what those facts make up to in my mind.
Fathers raise children too.
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Yet the father are presented with the choice to run away, the mother rarely does. Let's face it, men do their thing and can run away while women does take 9 month to carry the baby to full term, kinda hard to run away dont' you think? :lol:
I think abortion is wrong,
That baby has just as much a right to live as you do.
It can't make it's own decisions yet, but you shouldn't be able to make the decision for them...how would you feel if your mother aborted you? Obviosuly, you wouldn't have feelings, but if you could just comprehend that for a second.
Also, you talk about killing people in wars and what not...people who are in the military made the CHOICE to join...they didn't have to put themselves out there. But they chose to...
And what other people have said...the women's choice comes before she even gets pregnant, if you know what i mean.
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As for equal rights, I don't believe in that so much. It's not really equal is it? The mother carries the baby, nourishes it, basically let it grow inside of her for 9 month, I don't think the baby's pulling equal weight, it's not really symbiosis.
I don't really believe that something just conceieved has just as much, if not more right than you and I to live.
Well new borned babies can't really make their own decisions, although they do cry for certain necessities, it's up to the parents to choose for them. What kind of clothes they're gonna wear, when to change the diapers, when to play. Basically we're more or less dependent upon our parents until we ... become independent. :lol: and for the record, I wouldn't really mind (or know for that fact) if my mother aborted me. In life, there's always death, some do die earlier than others. In the womb, a fetus have no knowledge of actual life on Earth and it's kind of hard to comprehend and appreciate something that you dont' know, no?
Like many people said before, sex is not always a choice.
well sometimes when you are in a loving relationship , and taking precautions e.g contraceptive pill, you still get pregnant and I thoroughly believe that it is the mum's choice, we can't judge other people on their decisions, we dont know the situations, it is to the individual what they do, but they should do it before the fetus can feel pain.
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The pain issue, I kinda have an issue with that. Do we really know when fetuses can comprehend pain? It's one thing to have a nervous system but does that necessarily mean that we can actually
feel? Physical feelings also has a cognitive part, you can
feel pain if you don't comprehend it. Is the fetal brain, at the time of the development of the nervous system, complex enough to
feel pain?
Why kill the baby? Just cause you don't want it? GIVE IT UP FOR ADOPTION! What does the mother not want to go through the pain? Tough luck sister. If the woman make a mistake and get themselves pregant when they don't want to be, why should the innoccent baby have to die? That baby could be someone important to so many people, or very important to just a few people. What if Martin Luther king's mother had had an abortion when she was pregant with him? where would we be?
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First of all, adoption, not always the best answer. Two, sometimes it's not always a matter of whether if the mother wants to feel pain or not, Three, a baby.... can't really be classified as innocent or not innocent, naive maybe, but not innocent. I really have a problem with people describing fetuses as innocent. What's so innocent about it?! It hasn't even done anything yet! as for your last point, it's quite invalid. What if Hitler's mum actually aborted him? Osama Bin Ladin? Where would we be then?
I'm all for choice...as so long as it doesn't interfere with another life. I'm for choosing your friends, choosing you career but a baby isn't a choice. The choice was made when a couple decided to go far enough where this might be an issue. THAT was the choice. To say you are "Pro-choice" is the same as saying you are "Pro-Abortion", you can't draw that distinction...propoganda and sugar coating is the only reason it's not "correct" to say "pro abortion". I, don't mind being called "anti-abortion" but I am "Pro life" also (pro life is more than just abortion). As for the Republican judges...I can't wait to see this play out...let's see if the judicial system can get it right this time.
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Quite frankly, I dont' really mind being called pro-abortion. I'm for abortion, if the woman chooses to take that route. There are couples who have children and decides to get an abortion. Quite reversely, babies are sometimes a choice, if you go off birth control, that is a choice, so that you can have a baby. There are couples who choose to have a baby and others who choose not to (by using controceptions) yet nothing works perfectly and abortion is often a last resort. I doubt there are many people out there who are stupid enough to think that abortion has no repurcussions and treats it as a form of birth control.
Alot of people think the issuse of abortion as "pro-choice" and if a woman has a right to do anything to her body. I agree that everyone should have the right to do anything to his or her own body (implants or something) and I am pro-choice . But you are talking about taking a life when it comes to abortion. The baby is already starting to develop inside the womb. Yeah I know it isn't possible to live outside it in the first trimester, but it IS developing. And doesn't a baby have a choice too? Is it fair to let someone else make the decisions? I don't think so.
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Well first of all, being in the womb makes decisions making quite... difficult, and secondly, we don't make the choice to die (except in the case of suicide) even after we are born, we die. The decision, while we were in the womb is more or less our parents, they choose to give you and I life just as if someone choose to get an abortion and not give life. I think that life as we know it, it's quite different from just, life on its own, because the life that we know, we have luxuries (like coming online
) and we have people who love us, we have sentimental values, memory. Life in essense is just the ability to breath and eat and grow and reporduce. If life was just an empty shell of the same process being repeated over and over again, what's so bad about death? We'll eventually get there. My point is just that in the grande scheme, having an abortion is just a choice that someone makes in life, would it change the life as we know it? of course but all things that live results in one thing: death. It's really not that bad of a thing...
woah, did that make me sound really cynical and suicidal? :blink: (i'm really not :lol: )
i dont agree with abortion because the baby is living and shouldnt you give it a chance in the world? its just my opinion. i mean i know rape is a big problem and a lot of women dont want the child as it could remind them of the attacker, but it could also make them happy, because isnt holding your child for the first time one of the happiest things in your life. i wouldnt know but just wat i assume.
then i suppose theres the fact you might know the baby will be disabled or something when born. but unless you know your child will die by having the baby, what is wrong by having a disabled child... they can have a happy life too.
i think the only reason you should have an abortion is if you know the child you are carrying is going to die. xx helen xx
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Babies that results from rape, that's a whole different thing psychologically. What if your child looks alot like the rapest? there is no way that he or she would not remind the woman of the tramatic experience, of course, having a child is supposidly one of the best things that could happen to a woman (or so it's said) but is it really worth it to have a child that is the result of rape?
Ummm... not many children die right out of the womb. They either die inside the womb or they could die of bleeding when they are born (which may be caused by genetic disorders such as hemophilia) but those who die in infancy would die of genetic diseases. Crie de Chat, Edward Syndrome, Patau Syndrome, so many other things. These babies would die, very soon too, is it right to abort them or should they be aborted according to the mother's choice? And the risks for genetic diseases increases as the woman gets older (because her eggs becomes older and during meitosis the chance of an untangled gene or whatever becomes greater) It's not a matter of whether if the child will die or not, in the end, the choice is basically whether if the woman wants to give life or not.
What I mean is that genarally unless you are a terribly screwed up person, you are not going to tell a child that they are unwanted and a mistake. Also at least those who are in foster care are alive and on this earth.
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Hey there are children who are being abused out there. Do you really think they feel that they're wanted? it's not a matter of whether if they're told they're wanted or not because actions speaks louder than words. How can you say that someone wants their child if they're abusing them? And dear, life isn't such a great thing for those who don't know what life is. Being alive, isn't always the best thing.
First off if christians can't pray in schools and buisnesses our society is obviously not having the Bible as a handbook. Second of all he/or she is not a bunch of tissue. At three days after conception they have a preliminary nervous system. At three weeks after conception the heart starts beating.At six week you can see there spinal cord and they can suck their thumb. At 8 weeks every organ is there. If that's not life, then how do we know that any of us are really alive? Because we aren't in our mothers womb? Because we are dependant on our mothers heart to beat blood into us so we can live? If so I've got news for you. When we're first born we need our mothers milk. When we're 7 months old we are as helpless as a fish in a net. We aren't even considered able to take care of ourselves until we're 18 unless granted special permission from the government. Where will we draw the line in the future? 5 days after birth? 5 months? 5 years? 18? Abortion shouldn't even be considered. Every day I look at my baby sister and think how could i ever live without her? she is so special. There are so many special others. how can we blow out their candle, their chance? You guys will proabably think that I'm just spouting off a bunch of BS.But a little girl, or a little boys life isn't something to laugh about. Kids who have cancer are taken care off. Why not these? saying that it's MY body and MY life us just selfish. It's only thinking about what you want, not what they could. If you are irrasponsible enough to get pregnant when your young then, you should of thought about that you could be bringing a life into the world. If you were raped then at least something good came out of it. This is a serious problem, and we need to take our heads out of the clouds and solve it.
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um.. can you define "preliminary nervous system?" because, if i recall correctly from Bio class, at day 3, the fertilized ovum is about 8 cells. not much room for any nervous system there. Quite frankly, we're very dependent upon our parents, even when we are adults. We do have parents for a reason, they nurture us, helps heal us mentally and physically, they're capable of a lot of things. Capable, but not necessarily do. There is no solid definition for life. We don't have the necessary things to live if your parents dont' provide for us and shelter us from the bads of the world. How much we depend on our parents doesn't define life or death, it's the fact that before we can speak, or understand speech, our lives are solely in the hands of our parents and we, on many levels, belong to them,
Another thing is that if these women want to go to Canada or wherever, your right we can't stop it. But we can at least say that as Americans we are not going to let the helpless fall to the wayside. Poor Women will go to a back alley, and since they are children, I belive that this should be counted as child abuse or murder. Also they can't live outside their mother is true. But neither can a two year old live without a parent. As an explanation on the rape thing, If I were raped, ( which I highly doubt will happen since I can shoot, carry a knife, and know some Krav Maga moves, but anything can happen) I would be happy to at least get a little girl/ or boy out of it. I would probably be a little deppressed on the fashion in which i got them, but I would be overjoyed with what I got. On the other hand I am wierdly optimistic, so I guess some people don't feel that way. A rape baby is not a perv. by the way. And another thing, should we give druggies needles so they can be sure as to not get aids? Cause that's what your pretty much saying. And I don't like abortions, but I would like to point out that this is a message board. I can write my opinion and so can you. And I would also like to point out that no one answeared my questions. Oh and guess what? Killing Bacteria and killing babys is not THE SAME THING. Killing Bacteria is killing something that will hurt you, since when did a baby give someone a disease. And as for good bacteria, You do have to wash your hands sometime, it's just good hygene. No one forces you to have an abortion, no one tells you it's good hygene to have an abortion. By the way I think I've decided I don't like the name pro-choice, I mean we're all for choices, just not ones that kill people.
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Dude! As Americans, you're already letting many helpless people fall wayside! how about caring for the living first before you care for the unborn?! Also, it's always the child that matters more isn't it? What about the woman? who has to take care of the child, who could be very likely incapable of taking care of one? because that does a lot of good helping the helpless, by putting them into hands of those who are incapable of making thigns better. Not everyone in the world can shoot, throw a knife or do Krav Maga nor would anyone actually carry a gun or a knife normally when they go out. You would probably not be very ... happy, so to speak, if you didn't have what it takes to raise a baby that you got out of a life-scarring experience. Oh and I would give druggies needles. What's worse? druggie with AIDS who can pass it on to more people or just a druggie? and no one forces you to wash your hands. :blink: maybe besides your mother... :blink:
I agree. When a couple chooses to have sex they need to recognize the consequences of their choice including pregnancy, STD's, and emotional connectedness. Sex should not be a decision or accident based upon selfishness, but on love for each other and the understanding another possible life could be created from that love. I think many people have sex for their own pleasure and do not think about the possible results.
Abortion is an individual decision, but trumping the individuals "right" is also a moral decision. Just because something is lawful, does not make it permissible. As with any lifelong deicision a lot of thought and soul searching should go into the decision. I would hate to hear of a woman who took lightly this decision simply because it was her "right" or her "body".
I do not judge others that choose to have abortions, it makes me incredibly sad that people choose to end an innocent life with such potential. God created all life and for a mere human to think under any circumstance that they have the "right" to take away that life is incomprehensible to me. There has to be a standard of what is right and wrong. We cannot live with the idea that what is right for me is right for me. This is self centeredness and individualistic. Society cannot survive standing alone on the individual.
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Well in society today, sex is also partially done for pleasure. There's nothing wrong with sex, and it's not always procreation. it's not all about making more babies. To me, the world's already populated enough. I do not believe in any God, I definitly dont' believe in the creation theories, humans are not "mere" and while society works as a whole, human nature is very selfish. We make a lot of decisions because we are selfish, why do you think children fight over toys? I believe that no matter how old you are, you have the right to be selfish, not everything is about giving out to society, sometimes you have to think what's the best for you.
First, the original question was, ( for those of you who are obviously avoiding it) " Where will we draw the line?" and the statement that life is from conception.
Second, you may have a website that says that women aren't sorry they had an abortion, but the very fact that their stating all over the internet that they aren't, says to me that they are trying to justify it.
And what about the life that doesn't have a chance, the one that never did get to see the world. Very few women die in pregnancy, I know because my mom was a OB/GYN nurse, and has dealt with that kind of thing.
If your really interested in checking out what " a bunch of cells" look like than check out
StandUp Girl
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I dont' think the whole website is full of women trying to justify what they did. I think many women are informed about what they're doing, not everyone's naive. Believe me, I've seen many grusome pictures of aborted fetuses, and if it comes to a point where abortion is the best choice for me, I would do it.
Very few women in America maybe. Oy. the world doesn't revolve around America. In many parts of the world, there's no such thing as a OB/GYN nurse.
several years ago, there was a study that interviewed women who had abortions and many said that they had nightmares and one had a dream where she was walking down the street and she heard babies crying and when she looked for where the crying was coming from, she looked in a trash can and found body parts of a fetus.
abortions also cause negative physical/health side-effects and abortions have also been shown to cause higher suicide, divorce, and depression rates among women who have abortions.
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uhhh... can you show us the stats?
WOAH okay that was quite a bit. If none of my arguments makes sense, it's because it's 1:30 and my eyelids are closing. Oh and also, way to many abortion threads. I'm gonna merge all of them now.
--Mandy
