The problem with any disscussion about immigration is it comes down to race. Most people are incapable of having a rational disscusion about it. As Trevor Philps who is the head of the Commission for Racial Equality pointed out, every time a major poltican talks about immigration, attacks against ethnic minorites go up.
rach
rach
AliasHombre
Cadet
So this has been a problem since 2001 right? If its just Bush's fault....the truth is, its our problem, and neither the Bush or Clinton administration have done anything substancial to fix it.Spike said:
AliasHombre
Cadet
Anyone can walk into this country, be it a terrorist, a criminal, or someone looking to suck what they can out of the system.
If you don't see how letting in possible terrorists in the country is a problem then i pity you.
If you don't see how letting in possible terrorists in the country is a problem then i pity you.
ms.katejones
Cadet
But didn't the 9/11 terrorists come into the country legally?
I don't see how a bunch of guys with guns in Arizona are going to help in that situation.
I don't see how a bunch of guys with guns in Arizona are going to help in that situation.
And if you don't see the massive benefits that immigrants bring to America or any country than I pity you. America wouldn't be the country it is today with out immigration.
In fact aren't nearly all Americans with the exception of indeginous people immigrants?
There are masses of famous people who have brought so much to America. Irving Berlin springs to mind, the guiy wrote God Bless America, he was given a congressional medal but he was born in Russia. Frank Capra, Einstien, Madeleine Albright, Henry Kissinger,Mikhail Baryshnikov,Sidney Poitier, Gloria Estefan, Frank McCourt, Martina Navratilova, Sammy Sosa, Michael Folds are all immigrants.
Immigrantion has made America a rich diverse country, constanting tightening of the boarders, will make America poorer not better.
These people have all made something of themselves and done so much for America to sterotype all immigrants as low educated, criminal terrorists is wrong.
Sure the man who has just been sentenced in Britain for a terrorist plot was Algerian and an illegal immigrant but your at just as much risk for the terror within as you well know after bombings in Atlanta and Oklahoma and we know after the IRA. Stopping immigration doesn't stop terror, stopping unfair trade and half or more than half of the world living in poverty stops terror.
I would defend America's right to close its boarders or use its buying power to further itself at the expense of others or have mass tourism but I will not then defend it from the risk that brings because there is no success without risk and you have to choose.
Jamison
Cadet
I'm all for immigration. My grandfather's parents came here from Czechoslovokia, his wife, my grandma's parents were German and came to America from Germany. My other grandfather was from Ireland and his wife, my grandmother, is from Canada. My uncle's wife is Norwegian, and has gotten duel citizenship. So trust me I'm definitely for immigration. My family has a very rich history because of immigration. But on the same hand, all of them entered this country legally and went through the right channels to get their citizenship.
My sister's ex-boyfriend's family is from Trinidad, he was born there and lived there until he was 10. His family immigrated here...but they did exactly what they need to do to be 'legal'.
Maybe we need to make it easier for them to become legal or give them easier access to the paper work and things that they need to fill out. I definitely think the money could be better spent, and not have these vigilantes.
But honestly, I do think something needs to be done.
My sister's ex-boyfriend's family is from Trinidad, he was born there and lived there until he was 10. His family immigrated here...but they did exactly what they need to do to be 'legal'.
Maybe we need to make it easier for them to become legal or give them easier access to the paper work and things that they need to fill out. I definitely think the money could be better spent, and not have these vigilantes.
But honestly, I do think something needs to be done.
AliasHombre
Cadet
American wouldnt be a country at all without legal immigrants. Theres a big difference between illegals and legals.noggi16 said:
ms.katejones
Cadet
noggi16 said:
We can't let just anyone into our country. For one thing, there's the issue of jobs and for another it just isn't safe. By screening people we can at least try to keep terrorists from getting, although admittedly the system is flawed. But an open border would be a security nightmare.
AliasHombre
Cadet
We make them fill in the forms for the same reason we have checks for people trying to buy guns: So we know who they are, where they are from, if they have a criminal background, and if they have a likelyhood of causing harm in the future.noggi16 said:
Bottom line is that illegals essentially steal from this country through the education system, or benefits, or as far as the imagination can reach. They have the priveledge to enter this country, but they have to go through the proper channels.
Well maybe if massively subsidised US products weren't dumped on these countries destroying there industries they'd have some jobs there. Your economic policies abroad contibute to the problem.
And weren't two of the most high profile terrorist attacks in the last 15 years committed by Americans? at Oklahoma and Atlanta. And all the school shootings weren't they American too? And you said yourself most of the September 11th highjackers were in the country legally so short of closing your boarders and banning all tourism, its a risk your going to have to live with.
So what if the immigrant is one of the millions of people in the world that were never registered at birth so offically don't exist? or from a country like Somilia where there is no civil structures at all? How are you going to see if they've got a criminal record when there from a country that has no police or law courts?
Well maybe they'd try if it wasn't so bloody difficult. And how can you be so selfish, to take all the risks they do and live in the conditions they do and still want to come because thats so much better than what they have at home. And if we're doing a balance sheet how much has America taken from the rest of the world? The jobs destroyed by American food dumped in third world countries that makes them stay in poverty, maybe if you even started to make trade just, nobody would want to come.
I like visiting America and will always defend it but sometimes you make it damn difficult not to agree with the anti-americanism in Europe.
Jamison
Cadet
We're not just talking about terrorist attacks in the safety issue...even though all a terrorist attack is, is an attack that is supposed to terrorize people.
What about gang violence? Or robberies or homicides?
I know that legallized American citizens contribute to that, but so do illegals, and that's a fear.
I agree that we should make the oppertunity for them to become legal easier. That would help to solve the problem, to have them documented.
I mean, Americans will no longer be allowed to enter back into the country from the US or Mexico without a passport...and that's US citizens! We've tightened up laws that affect the citizens that deal with travelling from country to country, yet we haven't sufficiently come up with a solution that involves illegal immigrants.
What about gang violence? Or robberies or homicides?
I know that legallized American citizens contribute to that, but so do illegals, and that's a fear.
I agree that we should make the oppertunity for them to become legal easier. That would help to solve the problem, to have them documented.
I mean, Americans will no longer be allowed to enter back into the country from the US or Mexico without a passport...and that's US citizens! We've tightened up laws that affect the citizens that deal with travelling from country to country, yet we haven't sufficiently come up with a solution that involves illegal immigrants.
