Juicy Wyr Bits

I really don't see their being one ultimate wyr that everyone goes on or with but I could see it coming down to several. I just see it coming down to the person to see what kind of character they want to build and then when you add in hero points and who knows what else, I don't neccesarily see a flavor of the month or at least that is what I hope :eek:
 
If you can own more than one then I see them as sort of being 'Hot swapable' depending on who/what type of work one will be doing. For example some foes may be magical so a Wyr with high magic resistance may be used. Whereas another situation may call for one with a higher damage output so you just swap them around as feel a particular one will be needed.
 
Homeslice513 said:
I don't neccesarily see a flavor of the month or at least that is what I hope :eek:
Click to expand...

Expect to see "uber builds" for every class/class combo, for the best class/class combo and Wyr builds for every class/class combo and the best class/class combo. I have yet to see a level/class based game not have flavors of the month, and the resulting nerfbats. And the next FotM. It's the nature of the beast
 
Well now I wonder ... on das uber build thing. Can you socket Uber Wyr for each of the two class mixtures that you will/may have or will there only be enough room for one Wyr for the primary class chosen?
 
Well, since there is not alot of information that has been released, I'll just go on the tidbits that have been. Wyr come in different shapes, and from what I have heard, the more potent Wyr may occupy more than one slot. I have heard that there will be class-dependent and race dependent Wyr as well. I'm going to assume that you will be able to socket any class dependent Wyr as long as you have that class in your build.
 
Okay. So i'll assume that if I were a Necromancer/Healer the (for example) 'Deadly Shadows' uber Wyr specifically for meant Necromancers to heal their conjurable fiends *may* cross polinate and also help heal allies in groups or allied NPCs?

I am of the opinion that if the uber Wyr is going to occupy so may slots it should have benefits for both of the classes that one chooses. Or at least be able to swap them out on the fly as far as one's two class choices go.

*shrug* You're right though. Too little info to go on.
 
WYR = WE'RE

but on another note.

If you think about it, to come up with THE ONE combo of wyr, there would have to be one for...

Female Burian rogue/wizard
Male Burian rogue/wizard
Female Burian Wizard/rogue
Male Burian Wizard/rogue
Femal Burian ....

So on and so forth.

Whoever comes up with THE ONE, better come up with a whole lotta "ONES"

Its all about your playstyle, your class, race, gender.

ITS ALL ABOUT how you wanna play.
 
Trust me Jon, min/maxers and powergamers WILL find a best build for every combo, will find the best race/class/sex combo as well. They will also have a Wyr combination for different situations, such as PvP, PvE, raiding, ect... Yeah, it would be alot of Testing, Logging and Parcing but that is what they do. Trust me, I know.....
*cries*

What is going to be important is how Simu handles it. They have stated they are not going for close class balance, but for uniqueness in classes. We will see how long that lasts if there is one class/race/sex/Wyr combo that is significantly better in many situations than the others.
 
Morneblade said:
Trust me Jon, min/maxers and powergamers WILL find a best build for every combo, will find the best race/class/sex combo as well. They will also have a Wyr combination for different situations, such as PvP, PvE, raiding, ect... Yeah, it would be alot of Testing, Logging and Parcing but that is what they do. Trust me, I know.....
*cries*
Click to expand...

Unless they hide the numbers from us. Like they do in Dragonrealms.

And I think you are a little too pessimistic about best combos.

Best combos usually deal with CvC, and there it is often a matter of personal preference as to whether defence is better than offence. Add plenty of elemental deficiencies/strengths that will be floating around, and you could be looking at a massive game of rock/paper/scissors/waterballoon/etc.

People are creative, and I have seen some wonderful stuff in games.

I still get a happy tear in my eye at the thought of the lag sorceress PK build in Diablo 2.
 
I might be pessimistic. But I've seen it for so long, and I dont see anything so far to make me think different so far. As for hiding numbers, easy to find ways around that, it's been done since EQ. Most elite guilds run progs that do just that constantly, so they can get numbers they otherwise wouldnt be able to get via just logs. It's how they could determine when something spawned in EQ for that rare drop, find a placeholder to get a rare to spawn, get more indepth information on a boss, ect.

As for best builds, there will be ones that have advantages over others. Simu has alread said you can "gimp" yourself. That being the case, you can also get combos that are superior. Probably the best we can hope for is they are situational, and dont apply most, or all of the time.
 
What Morneblade says about elite guilds is so true. Powergamers always seem to work out the stats to find the best character builds, weapons, etc. It's almost a religion with them.
 
I suppose the thing to keep in mind is that HJ is coming from a background of games that don't promote class-balance but rather class-uniqueness. Not sure how well it can be translated to a graphical environment, but in all the Simu text games each and every character had the ability to solo in combat effectively (albeit each in their own unique way) and in DR it was often more efficient to train solo rather than with another. Heck, some of the characters in DR don't even have to partake in combat to advance and be effective at what they do. Since there is such a wide variety of types of things that can be done, and those things aren't even really comparable with eachother, balance is kind of a moot point in those games.

It all comes down to the limitations of a graphic environment, however. Previous Simu games had the luxury of being able to do anything and everything they wanted by simply describing it. The graphics in HJ will force a simplification. The question is how much of one?
 
Evran said:
I suppose the thing to keep in mind is that HJ is coming from a background of games that don't promote class-balance but rather class-uniqueness. Not sure how well it can be translated to a graphical environment, but in all the Simu text games each and every character had the ability to solo in combat effectively (albeit each in their own unique way) and in DR it was often more efficient to train solo rather than with another. Heck, some of the characters in DR don't even have to partake in combat to advance and be effective at what they do. Since there is such a wide variety of types of things that can be done, and those things aren't even really comparable with eachother, balance is kind of a moot point in those games.

It all comes down to the limitations of a graphic environment, however. Previous Simu games had the luxury of being able to do anything and everything they wanted by simply describing it. The graphics in HJ will force a simplification. The question is how much of one?
Click to expand...

Interesting points Evran. I think that it will be intersting to see the 'Hybrid' that will result from the combination of what may be considered the classical MMO level/skilll based games with the flavah that sustained the text based MUDs.

I'm keeping my gaming mind open in this area and cannot preassign expectations based on what i've experienced so far from gaming to what i've heard of HJ so far. It would be easy to say that what i've heard so far of HJ doesn't sound so revolutionary but those may be the aspects of the game that incorporate what we've all become accustomed to.

Having never played GS/DR or any other text based MMO I can't readily "see" those aspects you pointed out yet, I know that there may be something else available from imaginative MUDs to possibly add a different flavor to the traditional MMO. That 'something' may not have anything to do with the standard mechanics but more so the imaginative texture of the game.

Obviously HJ isn't letting all their cats out of the bag yet save for some of the standard things one would expect from a graphical MMO which won't sound too revolutionary at all. I still say it will be interesting to see owing to the fact that, in my humble opinion, we've been conditioned by the standard MMO. We probably wouldn't know a new approach from a few leaks of standard mechanics partially wrapped in new Lore.
 
Thaos Nightwind said:
Having never played GS/DR or any other text based MMO I can't readily "see" those aspects you pointed out yet, I know that there may be something else available from imaginative MUDs to possibly add a different flavor to the traditional MMO. That 'something' may not have anything to do with the standard mechanics but more so the imaginative texture of the game.
Click to expand...

I think a lot of the 'something' is simply the flexibility to do and express pretty much anything you want. DR and GS are littered with pre-defined emotes (I would venture to say that over 90% of the commands are fluff emotes) and on top of that there are several free-form player written emote commands as well. This is a feature barely even touched on in the grinding world of graphic MMORPGs. Think of the game you've played that has the most emote commands... now multiply it exponentially and you get the idea.

Its kind of like an 'if you build it they will come' concept. If you give the players tons of emotes and even reward them for using them (DR had Role Play Awards where if a GM saw you roleplaying well he gave you an XP booster for a short while), you will end up with a less grind-based game simply because of player perception of how they can play the game in different ways. Ignore emotes or just throw a few basic ones at the players and you can pretty much be assured they won't use them much.
 
Evran said:
I think a lot of the 'something' is simply the flexibility to do and express pretty much anything you want. DR and GS are littered with pre-defined emotes (I would venture to say that over 90% of the commands are fluff emotes) and on top of that there are several free-form player written emote commands as well. This is a feature barely even touched on in the grinding world of graphic MMORPGs. Think of the game you've played that has the most emote commands... now multiply it exponentially and you get the idea.

Its kind of like an 'if you build it they will come' concept. If you give the players tons of emotes and even reward them for using them (DR had Role Play Awards where if a GM saw you roleplaying well he gave you an XP booster for a short while), you will end up with a less grind-based game simply because of player perception of how they can play the game in different ways. Ignore emotes or just throw a few basic ones at the players and you can pretty much be assured they won't use them much.
Click to expand...

Okay. Now I think we're hitting on something here. I would venture that, lets say for former SWG players, one of the things that made that game so special at its early peek was the ability to express one's self via the rather extensive emote/annimation system which has been stripped or scaled back to a rediculous degree.

Its what gave the game that extra ummph that endeared so many people to it and each other; something Sony completely failed to see and something I found missing in EQ2. The emote/anni system wasn't that large and you're right; as a result people didn't use them that much. So you had a lot of static chars just standing around while people played the game and chatted. Rather boring.

That may be fine for hardcore gamers but its the paint on the canvas for those who want/need a little extra *raises hand*.

Tell you something interesting related to this and Ventrillo that happened more than once. One of my former guildies I found absolutely hillarious in game. The character just seemed naturally funny. Then when the guild got Vent and I actually was able to talk to the person while playing that humor would vanish to a large degree. (an LOL! for me). If I turned Vent off the humor would come back to the character.

It would also happen the other way around. Some character that you'd think was an organized somewhat serious mathematical wiz at stats and skillz would turn out to be a funny goof in RL. So the process of playing with characters and maybe finding how they relate to the person that plays them is some sort of psychological fun for me. It seems from my experience that you don't get that kind of fullness from the standard fair and for me this is what has been lacking and you don't need Vent to see it.

So if HJ can pull something like this off with with some of DR's extensive emote system via a graphical MMo interface I think i'd be one happy camper.
 

Similar threads

S
Wyr Info
Replies
3
Views
791
milamber
M
frostydf2
Wyr all in this together.
Replies
10
Views
632
Ikiru
Ikiru
K
The Value of Wyr
3 4 5
Replies
94
Views
4K
Morneblade
Morneblade
Back
Top