Politics Republican National Convention

[Leslie]

I only watched some of the RNC. I really wanted to watch it to hear both sides (since I watched the DNC), but I honestly found it kinda boring. Too heavy on the Kerry/Democrat-bashing. And the Bush twins should never be allowed to make a speech again :lol: They were horrible, just horrible. Though I was amused by the delegates and their flip flops. Very creative. I have to admit I imitated them

The democrat dude scares me. And he doesn't know how to handle interviews.

[post="989183"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

LMAO. You should be scared of 'im! :lol: I agree abt the Bush twins -- horrible. But the bashing was DEFINITELY worse @ the DNC. -_- And the Kerry bashing is based on cold hard facts, sad to say.

 

[Spike]

C'mon Leslie. Yes the DNC had a lot of Bush bashing, but the RNC was just as bad. And I don't think either side just blatantly lied. We both made our points about the opposite candidates clear and both dems and republicans twisted the "facts". We'd really be letting them put one over our heads if we truly believed that only one party was telling the facts straight up and the other party was just bulls***ing.

 

[ivand67]

Watch out for Jinnie, she's like the Hurricanes in Florida with the warnings!

I'm just gonna say one thing: the worst thing about this is how some people get really emotional and think either of these candidates is gonna actually come through with everything they say they will. That's BS. Bush is full of BS, and Kerry has tons of BS too.

As Chris Rock said: "... the whole country's got a f-ck3d up mentality man! We all got a gang mentality. Republicans are f-ck!ng idiots, and Democrats are f-ck!ng idiots, and conservatives are idiots, and liberals are idiots... anyone who makes up their mind before they hit the issue is a f-ck!ng fool, OK? Everybody's so busy wanting to be down with a gang 'I'm a conservative, I'm liberal...' - that's bu!!$hit! Be a f-ck!ng person! Listen! Let it swirl around your head... THEN form your opinion! No normal, decent person is one thing, OK? I got some $h!t I'm conservative about... I got some $h!t I'm liberal about... Crime, I'm conservative. Prostitution, I'm liberal!"

Kerry's not gonna solve all of your problems and all the things you don't like in this country and in the world. And Bush is not gonna do that either!

So why are some of you into all this stuff so much? Yeah, sure, put your pro-Bush and your pro-Kerry stickers in your bumper and their stuff in your avatar, like they're actually gonna do the things they say...

And sure, it's good to support one side, but the whole point is, don't be blinded by everything they say. Only 30-60% will come true, and that's stretching it...

Whatever. Hope the Chris Rock quote there (got it from another board and edited it) isn't too racy for you people.

 

[spychick03]

Both the DNC and the RNC slant the truth to their liking.  But since I agree with the democrats more, I had a better time watching that.  Watching the RNC just made me mad, so I turned it off.

Xin Li

[post="984323"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

word.

 

[Leslie]

Watch out for Jinnie, she's like the Hurricanes in Florida with the warnings!

I'm just gonna say one thing: the worst thing about this is how some people get really emotional and think either of these candidates is gonna actually come through with everything they say they will. That's BS. Bush is full of BS, and Kerry has tons of BS too.

As Chris Rock said: "... the whole country's got a f-ck3d up mentality man! We all got a gang mentality. Republicans are f-ck!ng idiots, and Democrats are f-ck!ng idiots, and conservatives are idiots, and liberals are idiots... anyone who makes up their mind before they hit the issue is a f-ck!ng fool, OK? Everybody's so busy wanting to be down with a gang 'I'm a conservative, I'm liberal...' - that's bu!!$hit! Be a f-ck!ng person! Listen! Let it swirl around your head... THEN form your opinion! No normal, decent person is one thing, OK? I got some $h!t I'm conservative about... I got some $h!t I'm liberal about... Crime, I'm conservative. Prostitution, I'm liberal!"

Kerry's not gonna solve all of your problems and all the things you don't like in this country and in the world. And Bush is not gonna do that either!

So why are some of you into all this stuff so much? Yeah, sure, put your pro-Bush and your pro-Kerry stickers in your bumper and their stuff in your avatar, like they're actually gonna do the things they say...

And sure, it's good to support one side, but the whole point is, don't be blinded by everything they say. Only 30-60% will come true, and that's stretching it...

Whatever. Hope the Chris Rock quote there (got it from another board and edited it) isn't too racy for you people.

[post="989470"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

Because we believe in the philosophy of that candidate. Also, I trust Bush more than I have trusted other candidates because he is a down-home guy who truly loves his family, and he is also a Christian.

And hey, I'm just being honest! Don't knock me down for that...

 

[Spike]

Because we believe in the philosophy of that candidate. Also, I trust Bush more than I have trusted other candidates because he is a down-home guy who truly loves his family, and he is also a Christian.

And hey, I'm just being honest! Don't knock me down for that...

[post="990407"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

There is such a thing as seperation of state and church Leslie. I don't want a president making decisions because he believes god told him to do it in his dreams. I want a decision made by reason and facts. But I wont delve into the manner any further because it may offend people.

I don't know what you mean by "truly loves his family". I don't think you and I are in any place to judge whether any of these candidates don't love their families. Yes Bush is a down home guy isn't he? He grows up extremely wealthy, even though he has a sub par gpa and an 1100 on his SATs he somehow manages to make it into Yale. He starts an oil business of off Daddy's money that is famous for drilling dry holes into the ground. And then walks into office simply by using the "Bush" name. Real down to earth guy. I'm not saying Kerry is any better. He grew up wealthy too, but to say Bush knows what it's like to be part of the middle class is absolutely false.

 

[amy lynn]

There is such a thing as seperation of state and church Leslie. I don't want a president making decisions because he believes god told him to do it in his dreams. I want a decision made by reason and facts. But I wont delve into the manner any further because it may offend people.

It's okay to like the fact that a candidate is a Christian and that doesn't violate separation of church and state. Technically speaking, the term separation of church and state is not a part of the Constitution, it was in Jefferson's letters as personal belief.

What the Constitution says is that the government shall not establish a religion. Over the years, there have been many Supreme Court cases that further define this "separation". But still, there is nothing that says a leader's religious morals cannot guide his political beliefs.

That being said, you're entitled to your own opinion on that subject. It's your perrogative that you don't want a candidate who's religious beliefs translate into political beliefs. But it does not violate "the separation of church and state" if you do look for that in a candidate.

 

[Princess Jeanie]

There is such a thing as seperation of state and church Leslie.

[post="990459"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

Is there? Really? Think about it. Separation of Church and state is a little more than a catch phrase. It's idealistic and impossible. Everyone makes decisions and, whether conscious or not, they make them based on their belief system (which is usually based on a religion or a lack of religious affiliation).

 

[Spike]

I agree that we all have a belief system that in some way or another relates back to the bible or the qu'ran or any religious text. I also believe that you can be a good person and consequently a good president whether you are an agnostic or heavily religious.

But Mr. Bush has crossed the line. When asked if he consulted his father when making the decision to go to war with Iraq he responded "I consulted a higher father." Now I doubt many christians want their god to be associated with a decision that has resulted in the deaths of THOUSANDS of innocent lives. Mr. Bush has no right to make such irresponsible comments to a nation that is so ethnically and religiously diverse. His quote implies that he made a decision to enter something as savage and wrong as war because God told him to? That sounds a bit ludicrous to me and truly inappropriate for the US president to be doing.

I am not trying to offend anyone or imply that any religion is wrong. I am just trying to illustrate my displeasure with Bush's policies and methods of making decisions.

 

[Princess Jeanie]

I agree that we all have a belief system that in some way or another relates back to the bible or the qu'ran or any religious text. I also believe that you can be a good person and consequently a good president whether you are an agnostic or heavily religious.

[post="990531"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]​

But you missed part of my point...say you are Catholic, you will make decisions based on that faith, we've established that. But, being non-religious (agnostic) or atheistic, is consequently a belief system of its own, one which decisions are based on. It's impossible to separate beliefs and state...won't ever happen.

 

[Spike]

To an extent that is true, but it's the president's responsibility to set aside some of his own personal beliefs in order to accomadate society. The president's only right is to make decisions based upon what he feels is right and wrong and yes at times that consequently invites the president's religious beliefs into play because religion teaches us what is right and what is wrong. But Mr. Bush has done more that IMO. He has used religion too much in making his decisions. Just because he feels God wants him to do such things does not make that the right decision. The president has to be more objective when making such decisions of extreme importance and involving his/her religious beliefs. While I understand what you're saying Princess Jeanie I doubt any of us want a Joan of Arc character in the White House.

What seperates us from Osama Bin Laden who wages war against the US in the name of religion and when Bush wages war against Iraq while using religion has a means of motivation and reason? I hate bin Laden and Bush is a MUCH better person than Bin Laden, but I believe that the president should not wage war in the name of religion as Bush has implied in the quote I previously posted. It abuses religion's purpose and is all too reminiscent of the crusades.

 

[LRae12]

There is no such thing as 'separation of church and state' found anywhere in the constitution. The only thing mentioned in any of the documents is that the government cannot set up any state religion. The founding fathers had just come form an oppressive religious England - where you were required to be the religion that the King practiced. If the King was Catholic - everyone was required to be catholic. If the King was protestant - everyone was required to be protestant. So the founding fathers set it up so that the government could not tell you what religion to practice. They couldn't tell you that because the President is a Presbyterian that every citizen must be a presbyterian. We have the freedom of religion - so that we can choose to worship God in any manner we deem appropriate - or not worship him or any god or even believe in God. That's what makes our nation great.

But there is nothing in any document that says our leaders must not mix their religious beliefs with their political life. The Separation of Church and State doesn't exist...it's a fallacy.

 

[AliasHombre]

I think its stupid to justify anything becasue of religion, yet i still agree with the President becasue of common sense.

 

[Leslie]

Just a note: Christianity isn't a cult, and you're not controlled by anything when you believe in it. What I like about Bush being a Christian is that he will make decisions based on his faith. Since Christianity teaches kindness, empathy, putting others before yourself, and many many other virtues, I consider this a good thing for a President to have as part of himself. For instance, Bush is pro-life. As a Christian, he holds human life as sacred. That is one thing among many others that I love about him... Also, I feel I can trust him much more than an president who might not even consider the existence of a Higher Being commanding that we live virtuous lives (case in point: Clinton).

Also, just because the President himself is a Christian does not mean that he will impose his beliefs on the country, and it certainly isn't a broach of the separation of Church and State (which again I must remind you was created to protect the church from the state ).

Certainly, a president should not be discriminated against because of his religion. Saying that Bush is actually unfit to be president because he is a Christian is just plain old fashioned prejudice and persecution (something that has gone on since the first days of Christianity, before Jesus came to earth).

 

[AliasHombre]

All religions are cults.

 

[Spike]

Leslie I think the christian faith is great. Jesus is a really inspiring figure, and I'm not being sarcastic. But organized religion is in a mess. That's every religion including Christianity. Forget the abuse of power I'm talking about the hypocricies committed by religions and their supposed leaders. Bush is a christian yet he doesn't show much kindness. Well at least I don't consider the deaths of HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of innocent Iraqis to be "kind". Nor do I consider Osama Bin Laden's fundamentalist extremist version of the Islamic faith to be a true representation of that religion. I could trust any president as long as he has a set of moral values that I can agree with. Bush may be a christian but I don't agree with his ethics as a president. Clinton was a christian but I do agree with his ethics as a president. BTW Clinton is a devout Christian, Leslie.

Religion can be a wonderful thing, but I don't agree with the hypocricies and the bigotry of today's organized religion.

 

[Leslie]

I disagree with your characterization of organized religion, but we'll hafta just agree to disagree there. ^_^ Oh, and Clinton was not a devout Christian. He claimed to be one, but never really acted upon it. Also, actions speak much louder than words, as you pointed out. ^_^

 

[Spike]

Well a president's religion of choice or lack thereof is not any of my concern. So as you said we'll have to agree to disagree.